SMN - Why it is not a very interesting job and not a good upgrade from ACN

[RockStrongo]

I don't see what the problem with the SMN is. It's an amazing hybrid class (as in DPS by default, like BRD...to an extent) with very good damage and the DoTs allow for micromanagement of the pet skills (could be tweaked for better implementation, but I digress). I'd love to see some flashier stuff from summons, but given that the game is a little over a week old and we will see (hopefully) many more summons that change the play style even more, I'll hold off on my judgments for now. I also think this style of SMN best fits this game and any tweaks to make summons better would kill the ACN class. So I really think everyone should clam down a little and remember that we will get more summons and summon skills with level increases and content additions later on.
That being said, I'd really like to hear some opinions on how SMN should play (instead of 10 threads on how it should not) in a way that would fit into the game (just out of curiosity; not to be a jerk).

[shinros]

This is completely irrelevant to the topic and even my post. I was simply stating that the CURRENT game of WoW is very polished and that is what they draw inspiration from, not its horrible, horrible launch.

The points we are trying to make is that we want a pet class that focuses on pets. What we got was a warlock, DoT class with shitty(and ugly) pets that don't matter. In some cases actually messes things up(Ifrit stun, which is why everyone uses Garuda). The class functions as a class, no one is arguing that. It can do dps and even has a subpar heal it can toss out in an emergency and they were nice to give it battle rez and a shield. The fact is, the way it goes about dmg is not how we expected or wanted. It goes against everything SMN has always been in the past in FF universes. It doesn't break the game, it breaks our hearts.

Yup this is exactly what the topic is about its not about dps or any of that junk its how the class is designed.

[Lonlinal_Lifestriker]

and helping with heals. then using my tank pet to keep adds of the healers and other casters. i'm realizing with a good tank i can get most mobs down to 30-40% of HPs. and just use emerald pet
I'm cylcing auro, thunder, bio, disease on all mobs, then both drains on bosses*. then ruin it up. and I always play back up healer.
ALso with the +speed cast items i have on, I know for a fact i cast less than 2.5, i'm seeing my timer start at 1.9 so probably 2.
SO i don't know whats up, I'm finding i'm great DPS and never get complaints on it.
Its all about that Crict chance and +spell speed materia! I've spent all in INT.
But I do completely agree that SMN should have more use of pets and buffs from pet.
Would like to Actually summon a summon also...lol
But I'm sure the class will get more DDs and pet use in the future. give it time. I'm probably going to get 50 as SMN and then work on a SCH or White Mage because I know doing the same thing can get old.

[Sehkmet]

This job wasn't available to test at all. We are basically testing it in the live game. Posts like this would really be great if you could also offer specific suggestions on how fix/change things. Not just general suggestions like "make our pets stronger" but give specific ideas like "increase pet damage by 10% and give each pet a special buff/ability (Ifrit gives a damage buff, Garuda gives __, etc.)" I can't really offer anything myself since I haven't gotten to 50 yet.

I don't know if developers will actually be looking at the English forums, but if they are, I think that they will be receptive to specific suggestions considering Summoner and Scholar were not able to be tested during the test weekends.

This is not a test in the Live Game... It's the final product. It already released. Do you really think they are going to change the "core functionality" of three entire classes at this point? They did it wrong when they released the class by the last beta without even getting the feedback from the community...
Never in my life I have seen a Final Fantasy Summoner handling poisons, like Bio, Miasma, or whatever...

Summoner should be a thaumaturge/conjurer job specialization. What summoner always had in the past were Black and/or White Magic and aside from that, the powerfull summons, that were it's own class of magic.

Each summon doing a different thing. Ifrit, Shiva and Ramuh doing all targets elemental damage, Carbuncle giving reflect to the entire party, Phoenix doing all target fire damage and casting raise in the entire party...
With the release of Final Fantasy X, Summoner evolved to become a real pet job. Now Yuna summoned the pet, and it had it's own array of abilities, that were customizable(The Summon could level up, yes.). You could have Valefor learn the entire Black Mage magic set, Have Shiva cast the Blizzard line of spells on herself to auto-heal. Your summons could even handle White Magic in their own kit.

That is what Final Fantasy XIV should have approached in the game, having a functionality more similar to the FFX and XI one, where the summons have their own kit, and your focus as the Summoner is just managing each summon to its full potential!
That makes the job much more versatile and fun! When you play FFXIV summoner, you just feel like a subpar Warlock with Deathknight like diseases. It's sad.

[nimuniverse]

We know it's not going to get reworked (except if no one plays it). The only thing that can happen is tweaks on skills and possibly summon skills. So at this point either learn to like it or play a different class. If no one plays the class or the population is very low compare to other classes then, maybe, SE will change the class.

[Rover1983]

My complaint so far is the lack of pet damage. Our pets are pathetic. They need to be much stronger then they are. Currently I do at least quadruple the damage my pet does. That is not why I made a pet class who specializes in pets.

[wingofbenu]

Even though I am not a fan of WoW, it's certainly polished and was a good choice to draw inspiration from. However, mimicking WoW classes instead of keeping with the wonderful iconic theme of the FF universe is sad. They have pretty much ruined SMN. Don't get me wrong, the class functions as a class, what they have ruined is what SMN is at its' core, a summoning class that relies on the raw power of its' summons. The summons are, as OP has stated, quite shit. While FFXI wasn't a paragon of excellence in the SMN department(being a terrible healer with huge nuke bursts, but only every minute), it was still better than what they have done here. I don't have anything against a warlock, but it's not what I wanted to play, a real SMN was.

I dunno. I'd much rather be a DoT class than a glorified healer who just happens to have Fenrir standing next to me being useless.

[nimuniverse]

I have no issues with FFXIV ARR's SMN. Each game is different. I just need to learn the strength and weakness of the class and be the best that I can be. If FFXIV ARR's SMN is DoT class, so be it. I learn to play it and find that it's actually awesome when used properly.

[shinros]

I dunno. I'd much rather be a DoT class than a glorified healer who just happens to have Fenrir standing next to me being useless.

No one is asking for that either you know. I heard the horror stories of XI summoner.

[Warlyx]

cant agree more with the OP and every1 here

i wanted a SUMMONER , i still play it, and im leveling other classes meanwhile , but the class is in dire need of fixes ,and some spells changes (enkindle lower CD <yes,please>)

the class feel rushed , and a blatant LIE , this class isnt a SUMMONER , more like a wannabe blackmage (with dots) and a useless pet that follow u.

the problem is that we only 5 spells we got from SMN u can fix the root of the problem SMN is small upgrade from ACN

fester is awesome (ramp time sucks) , but enkindle 5M cd, ifrit is useless, and garuda is a 20% boost dmg from emerald ~~

SE didnt even changed the spells emerald > garuda , Topaz > titan , copy paste all the way baby....

dont get me started on spell animations......or pet design. /sigh