AH + Player Markets??

[Smokie23]

Said this in a previous post but seems to be an idea of its own...so thought I make it own thread.
Giving the whole dispute and rioting due to MW...why not try something like this?
Its a full AH style system but with player markets added. Player markets you can rent out stalls and still setup shop however you want. Player markets are part of city instances and not their own. Just like NPC vendors all over, why not give players an opportunity to open up a stall right next to them. I think the whole community would benifit more if people are able to supply eachother via selling to player markets instead of selling to NPC and the item is gone forever. Junk to some people is not junk to others and other will probably pay more then NPC price to obtain such items. Majority of player markets/stalls are located near AH windows, this will encourage player to player trading and bargaining. Stall rental may increase. For example: the more stalls rented out in one area/market the higher the rental fee is for the next stall. Obviously set in tiers and not stall by stall.
Players still have control over their goods, how they are distributed, prices and even controlling a part of the market. With Player Markets players are still able to put in 'want to buy' orders via retainers (similar to how it is now)...but if you have AH only the only 'want to buy' orders are through player bazaars, which are constantly running around. If Buyers had a stall (like a static bazaar, not one that ran around all over like the player bazaar) where they can set certain prices for goods eventually sellers would go to them instead of selling to NPC and the item is then kept on the market.

Do have a question though with AH, can you place 'want to buy' orders similar to player/retainer bazaar??...im not sure but I don't think so, most AH have 'want to sell' orders only.
With player markets a player is able to place 'want to buy' orders and also 'want to sell' orders but with AH only a player is confined to 'want to sell' orders only through AH. (or using player bazaar)

Of course if there is a search function...who is now going to spend the time to browse retainers?
I would still browse player markets/stalls because chances are they are the one's with lower prices then AH prices.
Search function made MW browsing obsolete...if we now do not browse people's good and have a way of instantly bringing up prices on all retainers, they should go all the way and implement a whole AH style system. By this I mean:
- get rid of MW all together
- retainer bazaar - gone (use retainers for player market stalls)
- have multiple access points throughout cities to AH windows (not just one or two central AH per city, helps with congestion, also stall rent price may vary depending on how busy certain areas are to help level out congestion and encourage opening shop somewhere not as busy and not as expensive to open up a stall)
- free city search for items, global search costs a fee
- your able to buy any item from any city AH giving you did global search to find what you need...you have to travel to that city to pick up goods. (maybe pile on another import fee if your to lazy to travel to pick up goods...like me lol)
- List of previous sales per item

What did I miss? Not perfect but I think it would work better then what we got now.

[AngryNixon]

Shanto in regards to your 'want to buy' comment Eve online has 'want to buy' so I'm told. Also it's not rocket science. Only a poorly designed AH doesn't properly reflect both sides of the equation in the 21st century.

If the AH doesn't have solid 'want to buy' as well as 'want to sell' orders from the open it's already a failure doomed to bear all the same faults the almost decade old FFXI system has as well as the WoW AH and is not even close to the standard of "next gen" anything.

That, for me, is the only redeeming feature of the MW for now. Although, even that feature is awkwardly implemented with how restrictive it is.

[Smokie23]

Shanto in regards to your 'want to buy' comment Eve online has 'want to buy' so I'm told. Also it's not rocket science. Only a poorly designed AH doesn't properly reflect both sides of the equation in the 21st century.

If the AH doesn't have solid 'want to buy' as well as 'want to sell' orders from the open it's already a failure doomed to bear all the same faults the almost decade old FFXI system has as well as the WoW AH and is not even close to the standard of "next gen" anything.

That, for me, is the only redeeming feature of the MW for now. Although, even that feature is awkwardly implemented with how restrictive it is.

'Want to buy' is the same thing as 'seek item' in ffxiv. sry for the mix up.
Not all AH systems are able to place 'seek item' orders and the one's that don't have that option are not fail. FFXI is not a failed system. It worked fine. Sure we could use innovation here and there, change this up but the systems worked. I just think it would be nice for more ways or opportunities for players to obtain goods. Going to a AH window, searching, buying, obtaining from window seems...to mainstream and easy in some cases. But by no means is this system meant to be 'next gen' or some breakthrough lol

Judging by the community MW is failing. To me I don't mind it, I can travel and browse retainers...I guess it just a lot of player can't do that.

[AngryNixon]

'Want to buy' is the same thing as 'seek item' in ffxiv. sry for the mix up.
Not all AH systems are able to place 'seek item' orders and the one's that don't have that option are not fail. FFXI is not a failed system. It worked fine. Sure we could use innovation here and there, change this up but the systems worked. I just think it would be nice for more ways or opportunities for players to obtain goods. Going to a AH window, searching, buying, obtaining from window seems...to mainstream and easy in some cases. But by no means is this system meant to be 'next gen' or some breakthrough lol

Judging by the community MW is failing. To me I don't mind it, I can travel and browse retainers...I guess it just a lot of player can't do that.

A system without the ability to 'seek item' is definitely not next gen or break through, I would never suggest a stale one sided system like that was anything worthy of note. My standard of failure for these systems is a little high I suppose. I don't consider failure to be outright collapse. The old systems were well established with their failings ingrained deeply enough that they were intractable. I played FFXI for many years I know it 'works just fine' like the MWs in this game 'work just fine'. That doesn't make them good, only the preferred alternative to using nothing at all. Recreating the FFXI AH for this game (because I don't know what other model they'd go from given it is SE we're talking about) is a mistake.

I should hope they're able to conceive of something better, and frankly the community has conceived many curious ideas for different ways to do things that are better and when taken as a whole and amalgamated into a franken-idea it has substantially more creativity and potential than what we may well get if/when SE changes the markets. When I suggest an AH over a MW I should never be taken to suggest that old garbage from FFXI or WoW. It's one dimensional and stale.

The "AH" system above all else needs to be efficient, convenient and preferably global (although that's not a set in stone requirement it would alleviate but not totally remove the player base clustering in only one city). The MWs are not. I think you're spot on in saying they should remove the MW, and that the system should have multiple access points.

Also, players identify a good many problems that are the result of a one sided system.

The MW, in theory (bear in mind I can only speak in theory here because the in practice implementation is off), should have helped in that regard by allowing for a full two sided exchange. It was also great that it allows you to put up repair items as a third bonus option. Not that that works well either with your money requiring its own slot (yes I understand why it is that way currently).

For the time being though I don't foresee the MW changing meaningfully from where it is now. It works, like a shitty old car with rust spots works in that it will get you from point A to point B alive (maybe), but you aren't exactly clamoring to be seen driving it. As long as "it's not so bad", "I can live with it", "it works for now", "that's fine I guess" gets you by, then everything's peachy.

[LazyKz]

Its a full AH style system but with player markets added. Player markets you can rent out stalls and still setup shop however you want. Player markets are part of city instances and not their own. Just like NPC vendors all over, why not give players an opportunity to open up a stall right next to them.

Interesting... sounds like endgame for crafters. I know a few that would get all giddy over something like this. If the number of stalls are somehow controlled, I'd say go for it. Sounds like a good spot for crafting goods to be sold.

Maybe that's how to keep it controlled. Separate everything... crafters get this, looters get the AH, everyone gets the annoying bag over their heads. Crafters can use the AH to get raw ingredients or rare MOB drops that benefit crafting & grinders / NM hunters can hit up PC crafting shops for ammo, crafted gear, repairs, ect...

Somehow build into it a system that allows trade in for gil (i.e. I can sell my crafted blah blah, but not my dodo egg) without an actual PC controlling the transaction. Allowing the PC that set up the stall to controll the number of max items in stock at any given time. This will allow, say a carpenter, to view the woodworking stalls for what’s on low demand, and craft those items. This way the market has a better chance of not getting 6000 masks, and only 7 clogs. And if you’re one of the 6000 mask crafters and you jumped the gun... tough, either carry them in your bazaar or sell to a NPC.

So, if I want to get an overpriced insanely rare NM drop, or a dime-a-dozzen raw material... I'll stop buy the AH. If I want to get a good priced crafted item, or craft some random stuff myself I'll check out "XYZs" guild craft stall.