Keeping hate on multiple targets

[Shiftytank]

Hi guys,
I'm new to tanking like a lot of folks in ff14 but not new to mmo tanking in general. My experience thus far ( just the first three instances) has been fairly smooth. I do a simple mark 1 for first focus and by the time 1 is burned I typically can let dd's go nuts. I have found this works on both gld and mrd so far. I def tab target and my 2nd hit (threat boost) is always being thought through. I don't know how it will play out later but I really like it so far. Seems simple enough and dd only really need to assist or focus target once. One would hope that they stay with you the entire time but we all know how that goes lol. I think the only flaw is aoe damage being thrown out from the get go on pull. Any suggestions? Is this simply just a matter of (hey wait a sec b4 you blast away guys)

Thanks,
Shifty

[ZenBear]

Honestly I use flash for the sole purpose of keeping the adds off the healer. If a dd chooses to attack an add rather than my target I'll leave em to it.

That's Flash's primary purpose in a stable fight, yes. But it is your responsibility as tank to control threat in all circumstances, especially hectic ones when people are making mistakes. It doesn't matter whose fault it is; you're the tank, so deal with it.

@Shiftytank:
Having DDs hold back in the beginning is definitely a good thing, and any good DD knows to do it. That being said, a quick Shield Lob/Flash will secure your threat even if a BLM starts throwing Fire II right away (part of you job as tank is initiator, so you should attack first in any case), and you'll have enough time to get a full QB/SB/RH combo off before you need to Flash again and/or switch targets. Just be ready to adjust and improvise as the situation warrants; no single rotation will serve in every circumstance. Mental agility is what defines a skilled tank.

[Gorlioliolio]

I've found threat mechanics to change quite drastically from the first 3 up to qarn now, in the first 3 dungeons I would lob, flash flash then fast blade > riot blade > flash until mob 1 was dead then switch off to mob 2, repeat and by mob 3 no more flashing required so fast > savage.

Now I find that flash agro is garbage except for initial agro to keep off healers while I rotate my higher agro skills in on the mobs, so now its lob, flash flash flash, fast > savage > rage on mob 1, fast > savage mob 1, rage mob 2, fast savage mob 3, back to mob 1 rinse repeat

[Vamp]

Like everyone had been saying, practice threat management. Use these situations to get better at regaining and keeping hate throughout the fights. I always mark my targets and ask to have a mob put to sleep. This leaves me with keeping aggro on only two mobs which is easy. Just be sure to give the other mob some love as you drop the first one. If your dps is all over however, mark the target the highest dps is on and keep some hate going to both targets. Don't punish you healer when the dps won't listen. Besides, being able to overcome difficult situations makes you a better tank in the long run.

[Kenji1134]

One of the major things is that classes start getting 10-15% damage buffs, and stronger attacks... All we have for aoe is Flash.
Personally, I hate tanking Qarn because it is the last dungeon before you can sync to 40 and keep Shield Oath. That means that healers are healing more, dps are doing more damage... but PLD STILL doesnt have its 2x hate stance. That stance makes a world of difference.
Luckily at 50, we get the stance, and Circle of Scorn, which is very handy for initial aoe threat.

Frankly the simplest solution for this would be to make Shield Oath be the lvl 30 skill, not lvl 40.

[Dilleria]

Gorlio, I understand where you are coming from. I do think tanks need to be accountable for themselves regardless, but I've had times where I'll mark everything from mob 1-4, beg them to follow the order, they don't...one starts shuffling between 2 mobs and I'm supposed to pull aggro from 3 mobs because the DD's wanna "be awesome"....sorry man...it starts to get frustrating...A tank can only do there job so much...that's why it's a team effort.

[Shiftytank]

Thanks for replies guys. I should have mentioned that I do start with Shield lob and flash or tomahawk and "forget the name" MRD funnel move etc..At that point I start my rotation and tab target accordingly.I really just like the low maintenance of just marking 1 target.Zen, noted on the AOE action though.TYVM - I don't know if any of the whopping 6-7 runs I have done included some mass AOE from DD yet but I do feel better knowing that I can at least flash and let them go AOE after a few hits.

[IndigoHawk]

In addition to making sure your rotations are good and flexible, if your group won't coordinate, prioritize. If you can't keep all the aggro, keep some of it, and keep an eye on your healer. After the fight, remind people how they can follow your lead.

An important part of being a tank is remaining calm and providing leadership. Don't spam abilities while losing control of the fight. Don't split your focus if you'll lose aggro on a more important target. However, switch to a DPS or healer target if necessary, as being stubborn makes the fight harder. Being a leader means making the most of bad players, and showing them what you expect and how they can improve. Your team should lose when they don't follow your lead, not because you've panicked and stopped leading.

If your group mistakenly says you're bad, remind them how they can assist you.

[Aphel]

Marking targets is important. If there are 3 mobs and you've marked all of them, it gives the DPS a sense of what to hit next. If you only marked 1 mob out of 3 then after the first one goes down you're going to have trouble with threat unless you've been keeping flashes up.

This is just my opinion, but I think people who are having trouble keeping threat on multiple mobs are the ones who don't mark.

If you've been marking, keeping flashes up and still losing aggro, then it might be an over-zealous DPS or something.

[Asmodeus]

I think marking is overrated when tanking, we keep seeing this but dont really see how to keep aggro itself. The first 3 or 4 dungeons you can get away with fb/sb/roh/flash but it doesn't cut it later on. If you need to mark the mob then the you need to take a few mins to explain the gameplan before running off all leeroy jenkins.

The game might make you believe that is all but you need to rotate your attacks, fb/sb/roh on first mob flash and then rotate your combos, fb on one sb on the next one roh on the next then flash etc. Also gear is very important on a tank, if you have all white gear you gonna take more damage etc and everything will be that much harder over all. After the first 3 dungeons don't be afraid to farm for some gear. Macros are your friend when it comes to buffs, use it and abuse it.

edit:

True..

I don't mean it is a bad idea only that it's seems to be something that is said over and over and doesn't seem to be the most important thing in tanking. Dps should know to stick to your first mob you attack, like you say team make makes a difference too. Seems to me if they stay on the first critter till its dead by the time it dies it doesn't really matter which one they hit as you should have decent aggro on the rest via your rotations an flash, ofc I will say at beginning of quest if mob X pops up kill that one first if there is a kill order, I just expect dps to use a bit common sense.

What is great if when person casting sleep marks the mob so we all know to leave that one alone, dps avoids it and I can drag rest of mob away from it.

They need to get rid of the post limit in these forum it's silly, we can't have a proper conversation with that in place lol