Dragoons: A Rotation Reborn

[Anisto]

It was more than likely discussed earlier but in a quick scan of the pages I was unable to find it, but would anyone mind discussing aoe dpsing? I struggle with tp management every time I try a wp speed run. When invigorate is up I'm ok but when it's not I end up Ll but sitting half the fight out....

[EasymodeX]

WP speedruns are different from normal AOE.

1. HT-ROT spam (no DS) is the most damage/tp for 3-4 targets. This will lighten the load on normal dungeon runs where you have multiple extended 3-5 target pulls compared to spamming DS. For example, this is your go-to AK cycle. If you feel like burning TP, then Doomspike still works and is more DPS, but it will eat through your TP unnecessarily.

2. Doomspike beats HT-ROT spam for both dps and dpTP for 5+ targets. Note: obviously you still maintain the HT buff. Also, obviously you use ROT when you refresh the HT buff.
BLM).

3. For WP speedruns, your "only" cycle will be the default HT-ROT -> Doomspike spammm. The trick is that you need to time your cooldowns between pulls. Your cooldowns are: BFB, DFD, Invigorate. Never use Invig on a single target (boss). Never use DFD on a boss. BFB should be up for virtually every pull. Never use BFB late in a boss fight.

Also, your other DPS needs to not suck. If they suck then the DRG will run out of TP before the mobs are sufficiently dying. If they don't suck, you'll have sufficient TP to keep a good pace in the run (basically second best DPS from a DPS class behind BLMs).

[Anisto]

I'll put this t good use. Thank you!

[pandabearcat]

Make sure you credit the panda rotation once you become the best dragoon ever.

[Swarna]

1. HT-ROT spam (no DS) is the most damage/tp for 3-4 targets.

You sure about that?

Assuming HT buff:

HT-ROT (3 targets): (170+150*3)/(70+120)= ~3.26 DPT, 310 DPG
CT combo (4 out of 10 CT ticks): (180+220+160*1.11+20*4)/(70+60+60)= ~3.46 DPT, 219.2 DPG
FT combo: ((150+200+300))*1.11/(70+60+60)= ~3.42 DPT, 216.7 DPG
CT combo (10 out of 10 CT ticks): (180+220+160*1.11+20*10)/(70+60+60)= ~4.09 DPT, 259.2 DPG
FT combo (Dis. debuff): ((150+200+300))*1.11/(70+60+60)= ~3.80 DPT, 240.5 DPG

It seems like all CT/FT combo variants are superior per TP (for 3 targets) and if you're aiming for damage/global for bursting (BfB, etc.) you may as well use 3-target DS (3 DPT, 480 DPG).

I tend to use DS for 4 targets as well because the DPT difference is insignificant:

HT-ROT (4 targets): (170+150*4)/(70+120)= ~4.05 DPT, 385 DPG
DS (4 targets): (160*4)/(160)= ~4 DPT, 640 DPG
*CT Combo's DPT surpasses both at the full 10 DoT ticks only.

the exception being when I have to make every TP count of course (REALLY bad DPS, low TP, etc.) The general rule of thumb I follow is to alternate between best DPT and DPG rotations. DPT rotation for most situations, DPG for when I'm buffed (BfB) and to prevent myself from over-regening (=> wasting TP=> wasting damage potential) between pulls.

I agree with everything else, though.

edit: fudged Disembowel's potency, and yes meant potency in all cases of damage

[Ayvar]

You sure about that?

Assuming HT buff:

HT-ROT (3 targets): (170+150*3)/(70+120)= ~3.26 DPT, 310 DPG

Do you mean potency instead of damage? I also assume DPG refers to potency per GCD?

[Swarna]

Do you mean potency instead of damage? I also assume DPG refers to potency per GCD?

Yeah, meant potency in all instances of damage. Sorry.

[EasymodeX]

You sure about that?

The damage / TP was in reference to Doomspike comparison, so no, actually.

Assuming HT buff: [math]

Good point. In terms of actual DPT, ST[3] is better DPT than HT-ROT[3].


One thing I noticed when I was originally running AK though is that the exercise is to maximize DPS while still maintaining non-dry TP. Single target TP per second was simply too low to ever run out in that situation, allowing you to spend more TP to gain more DPS (shifting to HT-ROT).

Doomspike spam is generally "meh" for 3-pulls because it exhausts TP too quickly before the targets die, leaving you at low TP for the next and then the next fight, resulting in reaally slow killing.


HT-ROT ended up being a happy medium for 3-pulls because it dealt more DPS without running dry. Associating that scenario result with DPT and DPG is inaccurate, though, whoops ^_^.


I think it would be an interesting simulation exercise to compare HT-ROT[3] versus alternating ST[3] + DS[3], though.

[Swarna]

I think it would be an interesting simulation exercise to compare HT-ROT[3] versus alternating ST[3] + DS[3], though.

I would definitely be interested in that. Without any proof or calculations I have a nagging suspicion that the latter is superior for pulls where you use BfB simply because you fit a higher proportion of your damage potential into the limited 20s duration (Doom Spikes) rather than an equal proportion of it (HT-ROT is constant throughout).

e.g.

if HT-ROT is equal to HT-ROT>DS<>ST
then:
HT-ROT<>(HT-ROT) is weaker than (DS)<>ST

Where the () denotes when you are using BfB.

Without more in-depth calculations I can't confirm this, though.

[mythicrose]

Make sure you credit the panda rotation once you become the best dragoon ever.

President Panda , making dps rotation affordable to all:

"You can keep your rotation if you like."

We'll see how that goes. Ill get she is gonna force us to change and put small non theorycrafting free companies out of business

More like she'll introduce a tax on theorycrafters for their "cadillac" dps rotations...