Dragoons: A Rotation Reborn

[pompey_dan]

If anyone is interested in my calculations for determining that Skill Speed has the potential to be a better #3 stat than DET and possibly Crit, here is the hard data with summation.

http://www.amongthespheres.com/uploa..._Stat_Calc.xls

Your calculations do seem correct, if the person is simply spamming the full thrust combo and not using any rotation including DoT's, however if you are currently using easymodx's highest pps rotation then increasing skill speed just has negative effects of DoT clipping as the buff/DoT timers are very finite in that rotation, there may be thresholds of SS increase which would allow the adding of fracture, around about +200 skill speed would allow the use of fracture every 30s with out messing with the buff/DoT timers.

If the translated patch notes were correct about buffed DoT's being able to be overwritten then skill speed could become viable but you would also have to take into account the last tick of chaos thrust being wasted which would be -30 potency every 30 seconds.

Unless anyone can prove at higher PPS rotation with increased skill speed than I personally still believe det/crit > skill speed

[EasymodeX]

If anyone is interested in my calculations for determining that Skill Speed has the potential to be a better #3 stat than DET and possibly Crit, here is the hard data with summation.

http://www.amongthespheres.com/uploa..._Stat_Calc.xls

Your general mathematical analysis is good, but your general model is off.

1. oGCDs ignore skill speed. Leg Sweep and Jumps are a significant contribution to total DPS and diminish the relative value of SS.

2. Autoattacks ignore skill speed. AAs are a major contribution to total DPS and diminish the relative value of SS a lot.

3. DoTs only gain fringe benefits from SS, if any.


Between those three, roughly 40% of DRG damage ignores skill speed / gains negligible benefits from it. Net result is that SS is significantly less effective compared to its raw effect on the GCD.

All that ignores the practical constraints re: TP and such.

[Tilgung]

EDIT: Bah, check two pages back.

[THEJOWENS]

Don't believe anything about the BiS will change post patch, considering the logic Det>Crit>SS.

http://xivdb.com/?wardrobe/4191/DRG---Allagan-Spear-BiS

DB hasn't been updated yet but with the changes to the Allagan Earrings of Maiming and the Allagan Spear the stats will be:

ACC: 471, DET:148, CRIT: 87, SS: 27

With HQ Buttons that puts us at: DET: 164, CRIT: 97, SS:27

EDIT: I math'ed a bit more as I was comparing some of the new accessories and found that if anyone prefers more crit they may substitute the Allagan Ring of Striking and Hero's Necklace of Slaying with the Vortex Ring of Striking and Allagan Choker of Maiming, as there is no difference in total objective stats.

With the weights:

Det: 0.22
Crit: 0.16

ARS + HNS = 27 Acc, 16 Crit, 8 Det = 4.32 total objective.
VRS + ACM = 27 Acc, 27 Crit = 4.32 total objective.

Though I prefer Determination still.

[Swarna]

If anyone is interested in my calculations for determining that Skill Speed has the potential to be a better #3 stat than DET and possibly Crit, here is the hard data with summation.

http://www.amongthespheres.com/uploa..._Stat_Calc.xls

Two points:
-The value of Crit rating is lower than shown because Life Surge and Internal Release favour other stats (sans SS for Life Surge) for the globals in which they are used.
-The value of Skill speed is lower than shown because it does not affect our off-global jumps/leg sweeps at all (while DET and Crit do) which will account for about 16 potency/second in update 2.1. Also, unless the animation times of jumps have been reduced to an amount where they won't delay the execution of the subsequent on-global attack the value of Skill speed is also even more slighly less (as you gain no benefit from the stat for those globals). Life Surge also does not benefit at all from Skill Speed.

Therefore, it would be more accurate to observe the benefit of stats based on a simulation of actions in a "perfect rotation".

That being said, I do tend to think SS is vastly underrated and that its main complaint (TP starving) is highly-exaggerated. Its usage becomes largely pointless if we consider a static rotation based on our buff and DoT timers where the extra attack speed doesn't get put to much use.

[Erik_the_Dragoon]

The value of Skill speed is lower than shown because it does not affect our off-global jumps/leg sweeps at all (while DET and Crit do) which will account for about 16 potency/second in update 2.1.

If the translated patch notes were correct about buffed DoT's being able to be overwritten then skill speed could become viable but you would also have to take into account the last tick of chaos thrust being wasted which would be -30 potency every 30 seconds.

Swarna and Pompey_Dan, thank you for your thoughtful and informative responses which have been plenty convincing.

If you can stack DoT in 2.1 that would be nice!

[AugustusSB]

With the new gear the BiS gear does change, although this change is really minimal.

Assuming weights are as follows:
Statistic Weight
Weapon Damage 7.540
Strength 1.000
Determination 0.220
Critical Hit Rating 0.160
Skill Speed 0.146

The new BiS gives the following total weight when all attributes are added from armor alone, 618.176.
The old BiS gear gave a total weight of the following: 618.092.

This gives us a 0.01359% increase, really really negligible but here is the list anyway.

Weapon: Relic+1
Head: Allagan
Body: Myth
Hands: Allagan
Legs: Allagan
Feet: Allagan
Waist: Myth
Necklace: Allagan Striking
Earring: Tremor
Bracelet: Allagan Maiming
Ring: Allagan Striking
Ring2: Vortex

This was calculated with an accuracy requirement of 470. I can calculate at any number if anybody wishes, just let me know. With this setup the differences from old BiS is as follows:
-gain 8 points of determination
-lose 5 points of critical hit
-lose 6 points of skill speed

[Kicoe]

...With the new gear the BiS gear does change, although this change is really minimal...

Did you forget the Allagan Polearm buff?

[Drachnyen]

The new BiS gives the following total weight when all attributes are added from armor alone, 618.176.
The old BiS gear gave a total weight of the following: 618.092.

This gives us a 0.01359% increase, really really negligible but here is the list anyway.

Weapon: Relic+1
Head: Allagan
Body: Myth
Hands: Allagan
Legs: Allagan
Feet: Allagan
Waist: Myth
Necklace: Allagan Striking
Earring: Tremor
Bracelet: Allagan Maiming
Ring: Allagan Striking
Ring2: Vortex

Using Ayvar's list I could be wrong but i'm getting 628.862

[Phai]

Said this on war thread, and i will sai it her also:

Good Luck in 2.1, hope its ur time shine