A little worried, not about servers though, about Summoner!

[Lux_Rayna]

In 1.0 BRDs were the one class nobody wanted and now it is SMNs.

Everyone wanted BRD bc they wanted Ballad. In fact, most class-stacked parties had 2 WAR 1 BRD 1 WHM 4 BLM. The class no one wanted were melee dps. If you were a Bard, everyone wanted you. I know bc I maxed DRG first and ended up lvling Bard so I could do all the content.

[Sovereign]

Amdapor Keep is, essentially, a DPS race, especially on the demon wall. It makes sense that if you just hit 50, you should probably farm Ifrit for a weapon, grab some gear and philosophy stones from Wanderer's Palace, and then give it a go. Also, simply saying your post isn't complaining about SMN DPS when you then go on to complain about your SMNs DPS isn't really helpful. =/

[Valsh]

Demon wall isn't even much of a dps check to be honest, you get like 3-4 more repels after the bee repel. Just about not messing up.

[KageNeko]

Was this the Marlboro dungeon? The one with the poisonous yellow water? Whatever its called I can't remember. Summoner/Scholar are the absolute worst fighting that malboro beast and I can see exactly where they're coming from. That dungeon relies heavily on AoE and smn doesnt provide. I don't think its even possible to complete without atleast one BLM.

I've done every dungeon except wanderer's as a summoner so far. For AV, the final boss is easy...Summoner lb meteor the first add spawns, healer holy the second, done.

[Ryuko]

Unfortunately, the 'stigma' that summoners aren't good is starting to influence people.

For example: according to OP's story, there were several instances where people said "Oh, this can't be done with a summoner" before they even tried. OP may not have the rotation down, or may not have the right gear... but how would anyone know that unless summoners were first given a CHANCE to perform well?

Does summoner need work? Yes, having more burst damage for DPS races where you need to down adds quick would be nice. I personally think this is the 'only' thing we are missing. I would also like to see an adjustment for pets (you know, so they are more than just a tiny bit of supplemental damage), but that's secondary to being able to down adds quickly.

Waiting on the GCD when most of your spells are DoTs is torture. Does that make dungeons impossible? Absolutely not. But if people already 'think' that, they are going to believe it. There are good summoner players and bad ones. It's a new class and while I personally think the mechanics are easy, others might not be used to them yet. If a summoner doesn't play absolutely perfectly, and the party already has the idea in their head that 'summoners are not good', then you are going to get in trouble.

Personally? I have realized that summoner is weirdly similar to FFXI. There is a huge bias against it in party play -- and that bias happened almost immediately. On the other hand, summoner is GREAT for soloing (if you are doing it right). Every class has its ups and downs, I suppose.

It's up to summoners to break this 'stereotype', one party at a time. So let's play our best and continue to give feedback on the class. It's possible, but not easy. I also feel that we're somewhat unfairly blamed for other DPS not being so great. I was once in a Qarn party with a black mage. We weren't getting the bees down very fast on the first boss, and it was very frustrating. I was wondering if it was my DPS, but I was doing everything in my power to down them. Then I tried with another group -- with a black mage I knew from my linkshell. We got the adds down VERY fast, with time to spare. One time, I did it with a group of two summoners. We were having a lot of issues. Another time, I went with a different group of two summoners, and we had no issues. It is as much the player as it is the class.

So if everyone is doing everything they SHOULD be doing... we can fit into the party well enough to make it work. But then EVERYONE has to be good.

[Parodine]

I'm glad to hear experienced SMN's throwing their two cents in about how to perform well. I think in the DoT heavy classes, it's easy to write off that dmg, but if you manage to stack enough, it sounds you ultimately keep up with just about any melee dps + your egi on the field.

SMN has always been my favorite conceptually, but I think I'll level CNJ/WHM after I'm done with GLD/PLD for tank-healer utility w/ things and just to see people set up better strategies like the ones mentioned here. Thanks for the info!

[EdwinLi]

I'm glad to hear experienced SMN's throwing their two cents in about how to perform well. I think in the DoT heavy classes, it's easy to write off that dmg, but if you manage to stack enough, it sounds you ultimately keep up with just about any melee dps + your egi on the field.

SMN has always been my favorite conceptually, but I think I'll level CNJ/WHM after I'm done with GLD/PLD for tank-healer utility w/ things and just to see people set up better strategies like the ones mentioned here. Thanks for the info!

Well playing as a Summoner is summed up in the Arcanist storyline(lvl 1 to 30). Playing as a Arcanist/Summoner is about calculations and knowing when to implament the right combination of attacks.

Such as...

Adding together the 240 condition damage per 2 seconds + Ifrit Normal attack (100 potency) + Ifrit normal Skill attack (120 potency) per 2.5 seconds + Ruin I or Ruin II (80 potency) will result in 540 potency of damage per 2 seconds by the Summoner.

Also when to unify summon's damage with your own damage

or

apply condition damage to a enemy then send the summon at the enemy while you focus on another enemy and apply the same condition damage on that enemy as well to kill 2 weak enemies at once.

It all about strategy with this class/job

You can also leave your summon on the boss so it focus on DDing the boss while you take care of adds with the other DDs which allows you to perform 2 tasks at once in a group.

or

use the summon to help take out the adds faster during a boss fight or other dungeon activities.

[Blargen]

I've had the misfortune of a few bad groups that had a hate for SMN. I joined one and as soon as they saw me they immediately started talking about how crappy SMNs were, they cant control their pets, horrible players, etc etc. This is before 1 single mob was pulled, and speaking over my head as if I couldn't read chat. I finally replied with "Why don't you wait to see how I play before you critique me." They started some song and dance about pet classes and their pull towards people that can't play "real classes".

We flew through the instance in record time. They were saying how fast it was going, and how quick mobs were dying. Not once did I let my pet break a Sleep, and not a single person died, and at end of the run the two vocal people apologized to me and left the instance. The tank stayed and responded with "You showed them" and left with a /bow.

[Ryuko]

I've had the misfortune of a few bad groups that had a hate for SMN. I joined one and as soon as they saw me they immediately started talking about how crappy SMNs were, they cant control their pets, horrible players, etc etc. This is before 1 single mob was pulled, and speaking over my head as if I couldn't read chat. I finally replied with "Why don't you wait to see how I play before you critique me." They started some song and dance about pet classes and their pull towards people that can't play "real classes".

We flew through the instance in record time. They were saying how fast it was going, and how quick mobs were dying. Not once did I let my pet break a Sleep, and not a single person died, and at end of the run the two vocal people apologized to me and left the instance. The tank stayed and responded with "You showed them" and left with a /bow.

That's exactly the point I made with my thread. If you had messed up just ONCE (and left your pet on guard, or hit the wrong target, or hit a lag spike and died to an AoE), those players might have responded with something like, "SEE! I TOLD YOU SUMMONERS WERE BAD!" That's confirmation bias, and it's something summoners have to deal with while others don't. We have to be 'impeccable'. We can't mess up. Not even once. Because if we do, it will 'confirm' the stereotype that 'summoners are bad'.

Anyway, it's funny that your group was saying that pet classes draw people who can't play 'real' classes. I don't really see a correlation between what players play what class, but if those people tried a pet class, they would quickly realize that it's not easy in this game. Unlike other MMOs (WoW comes to mind), pets are not immune to AoEs. We have to worry about not only moving ourselves... we have to worry about moving our pet, too. Pets are also notorious for not 'listening' well. We can't command them while casting anything, and they automatically switch back to guard after each encounter. I'm glad that you were able to play impeccably and even got an apology out of them! That's a victory for 'us'. Like I said, though... it's going to be a battle to dig ourselves out of this stigma. =/

[Shirosama]

they have already stated summoner will be changed to que as a healer role, also i haven't had any issues with anyone saying they didn't like playing with summoners maby i just have the rotation down *shrugs* but i do a ton of dps stacking dots , spamming Ruin II using fester/ drain etc