How to generate more hate than a healer?

[Skies]

Tyrzea it's definitely not worth it to equip the PLD soul crystal until after you learn Shield Oath. Because it halves the number of cross-class ability slots you get and you gain nothing of value until then.

As a note it seems like your singular problem is figuring out how to deal with multiple enemies. Easy hints:
Don't forget to use Flash with some frequency, add as it may seem as long as your healer is not going Medica-crazy Flash should be able to keep the hate of the other mobs.
Cycle through targets, deliver a few of your enmity+ attacks on the secondary targets to gain a bit more enmity on them.
Don't be afraid to let go of your current target and switch to a different one once the one you're hitting is at 25% health or somesuch, the DDs will finish it off before you lose hate and you can start getting a headstart on hate on the other enemies

[KogaDrake]

So I can not say as much about PLD as i am a WAR, but what I can tell you is ever as a good experienced tank, there is often little you can do when your party you get from the DF is not that good and do things they shouldn't.

When I run with FC i can do a single overpower and a single flash (and maybe a few parts of a combo on side mobs now and then) and everything stays glues to me because my healer isnt overhealing, my dps follow my targets (no you dont need marks to have this work), if I loss threat they dont run away, and people do their jobs. Now when I pug with DF... well.. sometimes I make things worse by trying to be the good tank and tank everything. The thing we all need to learn is that, for at least trash mobs, if one goes off and you put all your attention on it and lose the other 2 also it helps no one (and often leads to even more of your bad tank chat BS).

[HiirNoivl]

At your level, if you're feeling lazy, you can probably just hit Flash after each Halone rather than comboing the other targets individually.

You basically regenerate full MP running between each trash pull. Don't bother using Flash sparingly.

Liked your post.

Never hold back as a tank, not only a little, especially on multi-mob pulls. I'll wait the required 3 secs for a tic of TP but I'm using Overpower until everything's dead. It's just easier to rest for TP after you've generated hate on everything and nothing's running around out of your hands. For Single Target, run in and use STUN right away so that you're not getting hit and no cures are being thrown.

Really easy way to keep hate off the healer.

[Rajah]

If flash is resisted I guarantee it's less enmity, don't spam it! Use it for blinding, if you feel it's time the mob uses a physical TP move or gets in a good critical, use flash beforehand.

That GCD of a resisted flash is better used on a shield swipe or RoH. And I'd rely more on a combination of shield bash and flash than relying on one or the other to save face.

Provoke sparingly. If you're dual tanking and your support tank is hurting, provoke and cover!

Generating more hate than a healer is not the question. Providing you use shield oath and spirits within, and promptly stun TP moves and blind according to the battle timeline, you'll save more MP, lose less hate.

Also, it could be your shield. A good shield is even more important than your armor. Without shield swipe I don't know what I'd do.

[Jahaudant]

If you're dual tanking and your support tank is hurting, provoke and cover!

Provoke places you at the top of the hate list, covering after that would be pretty pointless.

If flash is resisted I guarantee it's less enmity.

I highly doubt this is the case, it makes no sense and wasn't the case in XI either. I will test it tonight though, unless you aren't just guessing and actually have evidence?

That GCD of a resisted flash is better used on a shield swipe or RoH.
Generating more hate than a healer is not the question
Also, it could be your shield.

OP is describing problems in keeping hate on multiple mobs at the same time... none of this advise makes sense.

[Ariyn]

-snip-

The guy is either a troll or flat out doesn't know what he is doing. See http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...us-Stats/page6 where he says cure is worth more emnity then flash. No idea why you keep posting this stuff Rajah.

Shield Swipe gives you emnity based on the dmg you do (x2 for shield oath) that still does not equal to a single flash (even with the blind resisted since there is no evidence that a resisted blind provides less emnity) and no where even close to Savage Blade or Rage of Halone. The only good thing about shield swipe is that 1.) it doesn't break your combo and 2.) if you haven't used it more then 3 times it can be used as an interrupt (provided that the mob is not immune to the pacification effect).

@Op - keeping hate on multiple mobs basically comes down to learning when and how often to flash as well as learning to switch targets constantly using single target skills on each. Get into the habit of watching the emnity bars on the party screen every time you switch. It will show you were to focus more of your attention. General opening for me pull with shield lob, flash once all mobs are there, fast blade - savage blade - rage of halone on 1st target, flash, fast blade savage blade on 2nd target, rage of halone on 3rd target. After that it's just watching bars and adjusting as needed.

[Junk4Brains]

Okay first thing is first, know your hate multipliers that goes as such:

Savage Blade = 3.00 Enmity Multiplier
That is 100 potency non-comboed for 300 enmity or 200p for 600e (Actually 750e if you count the 150p from Fast Blade)

Rage of Halone = 5.00 Enmity Multiplier
That is 260p for 1300e

Shield Lob = 3.00 Enmity Multiplier
That is 120p for 360e

And Flash = (Weapon DMG*X)+(Strength*Y)+(Determination*Z) = Enmity
As you can see Flash is weapon/stat based and has no multiplier so you will always get more hate using your combos. So think of Flash not as your main hate tool but more as a 'placeholder' until you can use your more suitable hate tools.

Provoke has already been explained but one overlooked hate tool is Fight or Flight. If you are having trouble keeping hate, pop FoF. Your Shield Lob will become 160p/480e, Savage Blade 260p/780e, etc.

The second thing is, remember you don't have to use one combo on just one mob. So lets say you have your standard 3 mob pull. mA, mB, and mC.

You Shield Lob mA.@360e (if you they are far enough away you can sometimes get in a second one for more free hate.)
Then you use Fast Blade. mA@510 (870 if you managed to double up on SL)
Then you switch target and Savage Blade on mb. mB@600e
And you switch again to hit mC with Rage of Halone. mC@1300

You mix in flash generously and you've spread the hate around. I usually have my SL macroed to mark the target as #1 and Rage of Halone as #2. So even if you loose hate on the first target by the time that happens if the DD's are all doing their job it'll be near dead by the time it aggros the healer. So I go back to mB to since it has the lowest hate hit it with Fast > Savage. And then if I need to I'll swtich to mC and Rage. After that if mC is still standing I go in to MP recovery mode depending on how heavily I used flash and that's a wrap.

So in short.
Remember your hate values
Don't be shy about spreading your combos out over multiple mobs.
And remember to mark your targets/communicate with your party. Some times its as simply as saying "Hey DD's can you wait until the second time I use Flash to start attacking?" That can turn a nightmare of a party into a good one.

[Aegrus]

It's also important to note that overhes generate threat. It's not uncommon for some healers to spam heals, use a bigger heal than needed, or use an AoE heal when it's not needed. If a healer spams they WILL get threat.

With that in mind, you still need to generate aoe threat. As a warrior you should use overpower and flash to start. And try and get a fracture up on multiple targets(trust me it helps). As a paladin, using flash liberally is a must. If you have full mana, you can flash. Also, on all tanks, using your threat combo split amongst different targets makes a huge impact on threat and tp. Doing this ensures threat and makes the difference between an okay tank and an exceptional one.

Also. Remind healers that spamming overhes wi get threat. If they don't run to you once they get threat, it's a fail on their part.

[Dreamslave]

The fact that in your OP, the only thing you did to gain threat on the other enemies is use flash shows that you are not suited to be a tank. Just play lancer or something like 100,000 other players honestly.

[whycantiusebetaforumname]

Provoke is beast for pulling