(Un)Official Arcanist/Summmoner Feedback Thread

[shinros]

Black mage is one of the lowest dps classes?(lol?) You know what put your thoughts into the best dps topic and lets see where that gets you oh right but your the only one who knows how to play summoner right?

Oh you know your rotation? I do that too the rotation for summoner is incredibly easy try playing a monk now thats a technical rotation. Summoner is not a difficult class to play.

[Fire-Dragon-DoL]

Black mage is one of the lowest dps classes?(lol?) You know what put your thoughts into the best dps topic and lets see where that gets you oh right but your the only one who knows how to play summoner right?

Oh you know your rotation? I do that too the rotation for summoner is incredibly easy try playing a monk now thats a technical rotation. Summoner is not a difficult class to play.

Summoner rotation is, indeed, the easiest one to perform. I'm not sure about Bard, but summoner is probably the easiest due to the fact that you can brain spamming 2 buttons every ~20 seconds

[Kevee]

Summoner rotation is, indeed, the easiest one to perform. I'm not sure about Bard, but summoner is probably the easiest due to the fact that you can brain spamming 2 buttons every ~20 seconds

Every class can do that if you want to.

Every single one.

When you seek to perfect the job, SMN is very intricate. Whereas DRG, the most complicated class, has more of a priority-based rotation, SMN has a timing and judgement based rotation.

[Squa]

Summoner rotation is, indeed, the easiest one to perform. I'm not sure about Bard, but summoner is probably the easiest due to the fact that you can brain spamming 2 buttons every ~20 seconds

SMN is easy? 4 separate dots, with different cooldowns and reapplication times, and aetherflow management makes SMN fairly difficult imo (on top of unintuitive pet management)

[Fire-Dragon-DoL]

Every class can do that if you want to.

Every single one.

When you seek to perfect the job, SMN is very intricate. Whereas DRG, the most complicated class, has more of a priority-based rotation, SMN has a timing and judgement based rotation.

Yes but your timing judgement is based over 15-20 seconds (quite long). Not only that, if you fail to recast Bio/Bio II/Miasma at the right moment, you at most loose A BIT of your dps.
Not to mention the fact that the micro-optimization to reach max DPS is not that important because during a fight you have much more things to do (avoid things and such) that keeping your rotation up to get a hit, is always a bad idea.
"Time judgement" over 20 seconds is long, you have 20 seconds to choose what to do... is really long, easy.

SMN is easy? 4 separate dots, with different cooldowns and reapplication times, and aetherflow management makes SMN fairly difficult imo (on top of unintuitive pet management)

I played BLM and dragoon on a friend computer and they are much more difficult than the summoner, which is my main character.
Even play a SCH is much more difficult than a SMN because you do (almost) the same thing a SMN do + you have to heal (yea you don't have fester, that's the difference, you replace thunder with aero).

And sorry, 4 separate dots => Easy instantly, dots with long duration are the easiest thing to handle, expecially when only one has more or less different duration over the others (bio II), the others can be easily recasted in sequence.
What dot management? I just need to recast them before they expire. My biggest decision is to cast thunder (and SF) or not because of mana usage.

Yea, managing pet is interesting that's true, but at least that is what I expected from a summoner. Considering I feel the same while playing a scholar (oh and my scholar pet has 4 useful abilities instead of 1), I still feel bad when playing summoner, it's so stupidly easy.

If you take a BLM that have never played the class and same for SMN, the SMN will do more damage because the class is pretty straightforward.
In case he has problem with pet management, just take out ifrit and eventually heal him every now and them, he is more resistant.

[Zer0mr]

Summoner rotation is, indeed, the easiest one to perform. I'm not sure about Bard, but summoner is probably the easiest due to the fact that you can brain spamming 2 buttons every ~20 seconds

Get out of here troll. Obviously you can play any DPS class with <4 button rotation, but whats to say that you're doing good DPS? The fact that you have to actually DO something makes the difference between doing DPS and just sitting there with your thumb in your ass.

[Fire-Dragon-DoL]

But BLM has 1 skill.

Well 2 skills.

I guess you can count thunder as a third.

Basically ruin = fire.

You push fire3 when your button lights up. It is hard to compare rotational complexity with button lighting up reflexes, but I wouldn't really say thats hard either.
You also push thunder3 when your button lights up.

Instead of refreshing dots every 10s of seconds or so, instead you push blizz3 and thunder.

Bard is exactly the same except you only have 1 dot to track.

MNK is exactly the same except instead of ruin you have a cycle of 3 attacks that automatically put your buffs up. You keep up 2 dots.

DRG is the same as monk except you have to actually remember what stance you're in instead of the game coddling you preventing you from doing something wrong. Also its harder to keep your buffs up and you can't put up your DoT immediately.

Its very easy to trivialize any class when you want to talk about it that way, but I don't see the point.

Certain people have certain classes they feel are easier than others. Why does this matter? Are you asking for more complexity? If so, I'm glad to hear your ideas (i still want SMN to have some sort of proc or resource). If your goal isn't to make every (or at least one) class more interesting, more balanced, or more powerful, what is your point in being here?

Please go play your super hard class and leave us alone =)

I don't expect a super hard class, I want the difficulty of my class be balanced with the others, actually it's definitely more easy. I have 2 debuffs to keep up which mean 2 spells to cast every 20 seconds "MNK is exactly the same except instead of ruin you have a cycle of 3 attacks that automatically put your buffs up" how can you same is the same, first it's a cycle, second is 3 attacks, third is melee which also involves problem usually applying those.

I apply my debuffs from a ranged comfortable place (notice, I love being ranged for this advantage, but so give me some problems with rotation like BLM do), with no difficulty in re-applying those.

Bard I don't play it but in my opinion is even easier (nothing to do and you can move with all instant, is quite easy to play, infact is the best class in titan fight).

I don't expect to have a super hard class, but with summoner is actually even hard to fail. If you are about to finish mana you cast 3 energy drain. Yea you loose fester which is good dps, but comparing it to what happen if SCH doesn't have aetherflow, there is a huge difference.

It's not that hard to see it, When I see (same gear) 2 bad dps on titan and one is summoner and the other is monk, there is (still) a 50dps difference between the 2, because the summoner can keep up better. Same in coil.

Get out of here troll. Obviously you can pla any DPS class with <4 button rotation, but whats to say that you're doing good DPS? The fact that you have to actually DO something makes the difference between doing DPS and just sitting there with your thumb in your ass.

First who the hell are you to come here and tell me I'm trolling. I'm a good player, I play a lot with my guild (we are to turn 4), my main class is summoner so yes, I'm complaining because my class difficulty is not balanced with other classes.

I want difficulty because the game must challenge me, otherwise developer should have given us a 1-shot button and nothing else. Or we can play an adventure multiplayer point-and-click game, it would have been the same.

I want to be "punished" if I fail hard on my rotation, for example if BLM uses flare at the wrong moment, not only he won't do expected damage, his dps will be completely stuck for 10-15 seconds.

If I fail casting my fester when no debuffs are up, at most I don't do damage, but I have a pet and 3 debuffs up doing dps usually which are much more important than a fester.
Not to mention the fact that "at most" (if you are not brainless) you will cast a fester when there are 2 debuffs up and not 3, not when all are missing (which is a really weird situation).

If the dragoon fail his rotation his dps fell down by 1/2. I don't know about monk, sorry.
As a scholar I must be careful casting debuffs and swapping back to healing otherwise tank dies =P

See the previous answer for additions. I'm here because I want a better class, and by better I don't mean more strong (our class is indeed quite strong!!!), I want a more fun class to play. And SE at least thinks the same about some points, infact they are adding new spells to egis to increase micro-management, which is a great thing.

Have I ever said I want a super hard class? No, I just expect to be harder than it is now. Feels like Paladin used to be in WoW at certain point where you can press 3 buttons on cooldown to do dps and that's all. Lol.

[Kevee]

And regardless of how you respond, every Summoner/Arcanist, or even other classes, needs to look at and support my thread in the bug forum:

http://forum.square-enix.com/ffxiv/t...ially-24-mans.


It is a very serious issue that could damn ACN/SMN from ever doing 24-mans.

[Saltz]

Bane is pretty nice in the right situations. However, its range is not so effective in large AOE situations because its range is small.

Its range is 5 yards. I think it would be more effective at 10 or even 15 yards. That way it will allow us to have a AOE dot effect without having to cast bane multiple times . (not to mention we run out of aetherflow).

[shinros]

Personally I don't want extreme changes for summoner as saltz said bane could have a small range increase. As I keep saying my problem with the summoner is the pets the pets should be the main show of the class not the DOTS. The pets need to be tweaked and the cooldown on enkindle.