Please give Paladin access to Pugilist skill tree instead of Conjurer.

[Caladbolg]

@ OP

Hmmm idk there is going to be times in which the healer won't be able to cure pro/ss you and tbh second wind, feather foot won't be enough to sustain in a long set of events where you are solo tanking/healing.

We will see also what scholar buffs bring to the table.

I see your point but, at least up to level 20 tanking feels quite easy for a paladin and I think they are trying to distance the tanking styles between Warrior and PLD so I say that's a no go.

[niwaar]

@niwaar

WHM gets proshell. Its directly from Conjurer. Everything Conjurer has, WHM will also have, every spell and trait. So WHM's protect will be better than SCH's as it will also have shell. Its the same for every job. They have every skill and trait their original class has as far as we know.

This is in fact what I just said... Dunno where you were going with this.

To be entirely honest not many cross-class skills would do some classes any good. BLM and WHM get almost everything they need from their base class there is nothing from any other class other than other DoM That would even help WHM. They don't really need anything else. BLM gets a cure via Arcanist which is a good thing, but again other than the crit+ from pugilist. I don't think anything else would help.

This is incorrect. Many cross-class skills are good for the other jobs. Raging Strikes, Infernal Release anyone? Blood for Blood, Invigorate, Second Wind.. I could go on with the cross-class skills that are useful. The problem is that the only cross-class skills that are useful belong to the physical classes. The DoM have a pair from THM in the form of Swift/Surecast, but that is all.

So you want an additional spell to cast for the sake of having an additional spell to cast...

Yes, why not? I noted the reason why the spells were merged. But there is something to be said for the "fun" factor that is (at least for me) seeing and hearing shell go up on the party.

Except you run the risk of creating a balance clusterf*ck if you make traits accessible to more than just the job they originate from.

As I mentioned, PLD is designed around a modern MMO tank with utility on the side, where utility going unused does not break the job in any way, as the foundation it is built on is very solid.

I think you didn't fully understand where I was going for here. So let me try and explain it better. I do not want cross-class traits. I do not want to gain traits from other classes. That would be hard to balance yes. What I am asking for is JOB specific traits. As it is Traits are something we only gain from our Class, not our Job. We gain 5 abilities from our job and that is it. What I want to see is some Job Traits that enhance both abilities/spells we gain from both our Class and Job but also ones that enhance/alter spells & abilities we gain from our 2 synergy classes. Why can't a Paladin Job trait be to give the Paladin Pro/Shell? He wouldn't have it if he was merely a soloing Gladiator, but with the soul equipped he would buff those cross-class spells as well. The whole concept of the Job system is that we sacrifice the utility of being able to "equip" abilities from all classes and are enhanced by focusing on only 3. Why does that enhancement have to simply mean 5 abilities and a little damage/healing boost?

We don't need cure as a mainstay for hate when we have the needed hate tools to do our job as tanks. We're not D&D paladins or WoW paladins; our faith does not manifest through awesome divine power with which to smite our foes. We don't summon giant glowy hammers out of the aether to hit people on the head with. We're par the course of Final Fantasy paladins, as they are knights with weak white magic. We currently fit that bill to the dot.

We may not need cure as a mainstay for hate, but with an enhanced toolkit comes a deeper experience. Remember the days when a Paladin could hold hate on a number of mobs simply by curing themselves over and over? I am not advocating us being D&D Paladins, or even WoW Paladins. I would just love to see what they put in our kit to be more valuable than a token "lore" ability or two.

[indira]

dont matter magic spells do not scale anymore. your pld traits dont help it either.

pld has the bad end of the of both jobs but you really have everything you need as your main class skills.

[SecondNature]

There is a simple solution to this. Give paladin a trait that X ability has a 25% chance to make your next cure instant cast and heal for double. Saves the lore and give the class what it is missing as a paladin (you are meant to be able to heal your self to some extent, currently u take more damage than u can even heal in 2.5s)

[Dillema]

Only thing I want for the Paladin is a Lay on Hands ability. Restores target's Health to 100%. Say with a 15min cooldown. To me a paladin isn't a paladin without a type of Lay on Hands. Also want a awesome paladins mount.

[Grendahl]

The FF Paladin has always been a knight with weak white magic

This isn't correct. Please replay FF IV, Cecil may not be a replacement for a white mage (changes depending on progression in the story); however, his healing is also nothing to sneeze at.

[indira]

at the end of the day PLD is there to get hit, not heal.

[JudgeDredd]

Is the general consensus that Warrior is still a stronger tank than Paladin?
I thought they were at a good balance with Warrior maybe being a little more versatile, but would including Pugilist as a cross give too much of a buff to Paladin's tanking ability?

[Asmodeus]

I don't see why they don't just increase paladins cures to around 400, it is weaker than a white mage and doesn't break any kind of balance. It's useful when soloing but not so great when doing harder dungeons as it should be.

[Canopia]

The FF Paladin has always been a knight with weak white magic. Of course it's going to be inferior to a real healer in white magic. That's kind of the point.

I know, its like some people never played FFIV. Cecil, when he becomes a paladin, has access to White Magic but it was infinitely inferior to Rosa, whom was a full White Mage. It was good for group spot healing due to low damage AE attacks or a moderate single target heal, but Rosa was far more adept at massive AE heals and could instantly get any person, no matter what the damage hit was sans an inta kill, back to full health.