[Dev 1011] Failing Guildleves Intentionally?

[AlexiaKidd]

Guildleves, the content you love to hate

So I have been thinking of how SE could improve Guildleves and solve many of the issues with them ie. abandoning them, only picking certain ones, certain camps over-crowded and have come up with a few idea's.

First though I believe the original plan for Guildleves as we have them now was that it was supposed to be more casual/quick content so that you could login and grab some leves and go do them. The main problem is that they are pretty much the only content, so everyone is doing them as they have nothing else to do. Also certain Leve's are better than others in regards to SP/EXP gained so this also make Leve Abandoning to keep those certain Leve's more desirable.

What could work?

My first fix would be to allow all 9 Leve's to be available for selection every reset for every camp. This would allow people to freely choose the Leve's they wish to do so if they are in a group they can make sure they get the same ones to link if they wish.

Also be a bit more creative with the rewards, a lot of people have a lot of gill so it is not so great a reward any more. Maybe try rewards like 30 Guardians Aspect or 15 Anima as a reward something like that to get people tempted to try different Leves.

Next would be to change the way Leve SP/EXP is accumulated. For this maybe it would be better to give a lump sum of SP/EXP at the end of the Leve upon completion and remove the SP/EXP gained from the mobs killed. This would have to be scaled in different ways though.

For example all Rank 20 Leves could give 5000 SP upon completion, Rank 30 gave 10,000, Rank 40 15,000 and so on. That would be the base, then you could add a multiplier for difficulty with the number of stars the Leve was completed on. Maybe 5% per star so if 10,000 was the base and you completed it on 5 stars you would get 15,000 SP/EXP. Then you can add other modifiers like completion time, you rank vs. leve difficulty and so on. If they were to give static SP then they would have to probably have a minimum rank restriction in place to stop Rank 1's tagging along on R40 Leve's.

Possible Result

By doing these few things it would allow people to spread out and utilise different camps to do Leve's as all Leve's of the same Rank would give the same SP/EXP so there would be no need for everyone to go to Broken Water to do the best R40 Leves.

Also it would stop Leve abandoning as you could decide with your group before hand which Leves you were going to take and obviously if you abandoned you would get nothing as the SP/EXP is rewarded at the end so it would be pointless.

This would also allow you to retry Leve's immediately if you did fail or D/C as it wouldn't be exploitable because the SP/EXP and reward is only gained upon completion. So if you D/C halfway though the Leve they could allow you to retry straight away as you wouldn't have gained any SP/EXP until the end anyway.

I think with just these few changes it would help a lot with the current situation regarding Leves and make them a bit more enjoyable as players will be able to go out and try different Leves at different camps without feeling like they are missing out on huge amounts of SP/EXP by taking different ones.

Additional Idea's

Others also suggested a Grade/Score at the end that could be the base for what SP you received. So if you did extremely well you got an S grade and got max SP from the Leve, if you did badly you would get get an E grade and get less SP. I actually really like that idea as it would give some extra motivation and an additional objective while doing the Leve.

[Rentahamster]

I don't think this is needed. What they could do is to take a significant amount (let's say, half) of the potential skill ups/exp points that can be gained from the enemies in a guildleve and award them when the guildleve is over.

That solution would require additional calculations and adjustments, since not all leves have a set quantity of mobs.

[solracht]

Well, I assumed you were doing 3. along with 1.:

1. Implement your suggestion of making the potential SP gain for all the leves be relatively similar in quantity.

Which I took as all leves giving around the same exp/skill ups total.

[Jibe]

Guildleves, the content you love to hate

So I have been thinking of how SE could improve Guildleves and solve many of the issues with them ie. abandoning them, only picking certain ones, certain camps over-crowded and have come up with a few idea's.

First though I believe the original plan for Guildleves as we have them now was that it was supposed to be more casual/quick content so that you could login and grab some leves and go do them. The main problem is that they are pretty much the only content, so everyone is doing them as they have nothing else to do. Also certain Leve's are better than others in regards to SP/EXP gained so this also make Leve Abandoning to keep those certain Leve's more desirable.

What could work?

My first fix would be to allow all 9 Leve's to be available for selection every reset for every camp. This would allow people to freely choose the Leve's they wish to do so if they are in a group they can make sure they get the same ones to link if they wish.

Also be a bit more creative with the rewards, a lot of people have a lot of gill so it is not so great a reward any more. Maybe try rewards like 30 Guardians Aspect or 15 Anima as a reward something like that to get people tempted to try different Leves.

Next would be to change the way Leve SP/EXP is accumulated. For this maybe it would be better to give a lump sum of SP/EXP at the end of the Leve upon completion and remove the SP/EXP gained from the mobs killed. This would have to be scaled in different ways though.

For example all Rank 20 Leves could give 5000 SP upon completion, Rank 30 gave 10,000, Rank 40 15,000 and so on. That would be the base, then you could add a multiplier for difficulty with the number of stars the Leve was completed on. Maybe 5% per star so if 10,000 was the base and you completed it on 5 stars you would get 15,000 SP/EXP. Then you can add other modifiers like completion time, you rank vs. leve difficulty and so on. If they were to give static SP then they would have to probably have a minimum rank restriction in place to stop Rank 1's tagging along on R40 Leve's.

Possible Result

By doing these few things it would allow people to spread out and utilise different camps to do Leve's as all Leve's of the same Rank would give the same SP/EXP so there would be no need for everyone to go to Broken Water to do the best R40 Leves.

Also it would stop Leve abandoning as you could decide with your group before hand which Leves you were going to take and obviously if you abandoned you would get nothing as the SP/EXP is rewarded at the end so it would be pointless.

This would also allow you to retry Leve's immediately if you did fail or D/C as it wouldn't be exploitable because the SP/EXP and reward is only gained upon completion. So if you D/C halfway though the Leve they could allow you to retry straight away as you wouldn't have gained any SP/EXP until the end anyway.

I think with just these few changes it would help a lot with the current situation regarding Leves and make them a bit more enjoyable as players will be able to go out and try different Leves at different camps without feeling like they are missing out on huge amounts of SP/EXP by taking different ones.

Additional Idea's

Others also suggested a Grade/Score at the end that could be the base for what SP you received. So if you did extremely well you got an S grade and got max SP from the Leve, if you did badly you would get get an E grade and get less SP. I actually really like that idea as it would give some extra motivation and an additional objective while doing the Leve.

Thanks for posting this in here Alexia, I still love your idea

[Holy_Dragoon]

Alexia, your post is a fantastic idea. With some slight tweaks (aka SP/EXP balancing) it would be simply a must-have.

[Sojiro]

@ Alexia I really like the idea. That would be a great way to solve this issue and actually make all the leves worthwhile. Like button click for you .

[Arcell]

You know, failing missions intentionally isn't very heroic. I expect to see a change to how this is handled.

[Kallera]

Guildleves, the content you love to hate

So I have been thinking of how SE could improve Guildleves and solve many of the issues with them ie. abandoning them, only picking certain ones, certain camps over-crowded and have come up with a few idea's.

First though I believe the original plan for Guildleves as we have them now was that it was supposed to be more casual/quick content so that you could login and grab some leves and go do them. The main problem is that they are pretty much the only content, so everyone is doing them as they have nothing else to do. Also certain Leve's are better than others in regards to SP/EXP gained so this also make Leve Abandoning to keep those certain Leve's more desirable.

What could work?

My first fix would be to allow all 9 Leve's to be available for selection every reset for every camp. This would allow people to freely choose the Leve's they wish to do so if they are in a group they can make sure they get the same ones to link if they wish.

Also be a bit more creative with the rewards, a lot of people have a lot of gill so it is not so great a reward any more. Maybe try rewards like 30 Guardians Aspect or 15 Anima as a reward something like that to get people tempted to try different Leves.

Next would be to change the way Leve SP/EXP is accumulated. For this maybe it would be better to give a lump sum of SP/EXP at the end of the Leve upon completion and remove the SP/EXP gained from the mobs killed. This would have to be scaled in different ways though.

For example all Rank 20 Leves could give 5000 SP upon completion, Rank 30 gave 10,000, Rank 40 15,000 and so on. That would be the base, then you could add a multiplier for difficulty with the number of stars the Leve was completed on. Maybe 5% per star so if 10,000 was the base and you completed it on 5 stars you would get 15,000 SP/EXP. Then you can add other modifiers like completion time, you rank vs. leve difficulty and so on. If they were to give static SP then they would have to probably have a minimum rank restriction in place to stop Rank 1's tagging along on R40 Leve's.

Possible Result

By doing these few things it would allow people to spread out and utilise different camps to do Leve's as all Leve's of the same Rank would give the same SP/EXP so there would be no need for everyone to go to Broken Water to do the best R40 Leves.

Also it would stop Leve abandoning as you could decide with your group before hand which Leves you were going to take and obviously if you abandoned you would get nothing as the SP/EXP is rewarded at the end so it would be pointless.

This would also allow you to retry Leve's immediately if you did fail or D/C as it wouldn't be exploitable because the SP/EXP and reward is only gained upon completion. So if you D/C halfway though the Leve they could allow you to retry straight away as you wouldn't have gained any SP/EXP until the end anyway.

I think with just these few changes it would help a lot with the current situation regarding Leves and make them a bit more enjoyable as players will be able to go out and try different Leves at different camps without feeling like they are missing out on huge amounts of SP/EXP by taking different ones.

Additional Idea's

Others also suggested a Grade/Score at the end that could be the base for what SP you received. So if you did extremely well you got an S grade and got max SP from the Leve, if you did badly you would get get an E grade and get less SP. I actually really like that idea as it would give some extra motivation and an additional objective while doing the Leve.

Sounds similar to dfo. I like it.

[AshelyRiot]

Thanks for fully explaining it to me. So you complete the leve, leaving one mob alive, getting all the SP for that leve. Then you intentionally abandon it. Next reset you can do the leve again and get full SP for every mob. Isn't that double SP from the same leve? With a chance at getting it and doing the same thing AGAIN on next reset?

IMO failing a leve intentionally is contrary to the spirit of ANY MMO and SE should change it so you can't do this. I'm really hoping to get someone from SE to post in this thread...

Too bad if and when they fix the unbalance crap that is in leves then maybe they should do something about failing leves. But when you get a leve such as a Necro and get all 4 pages within the first 5 nodes is BS and a waste of time for you and your group with NOTHING but crap sp gain. Now you wonder why people fail and keep the good leves especially at 45+

[Kilta_Firelotus]

Personally I see it as an exploit no matter what ppl say. Its the same crap different barn in Aion. Aion has something similar to this issue in the reverse. Once you hit say 35 you intentionally kill your character over and over again completely removing any exp you have making for a huge buyback. They do this to prevent them from leveling past 35 to "rift" to do pvp well forcing pvp down the throats of level 25's. Even though there is a pvpve warzone FOR pvp.

I think ppl should play the game as intended. As in completing the levequest. Exploiting levequests for higher sp on mobs isn't being effienct its expoiting a system and being lazy. levequests are glorified fov pages which is why u get sp per mob. And from what i know sp and gil after completion maybe an item for the starter.

I hope it gets fixed because it is an exploit as ppl are not playing as intended. And the abondon leve option was if you got it and couldn't do it since you only can do 8 at a time. I personally think its stupid.