[Dev 1011] Failing Guildleves Intentionally?

[Jibe]

Ah yes, the infamous "Inferno" leve exploit.

In all honesty, they should just make it so the leve disappears from the journal when you fail. I know it screws over some of the people who d/c but crafting works that way so why not? Its not very hero-esque to fail intentionally at the last minute

I think this is a very good solution. Crafting leves don't allow you to retry when you fail them. And technically it is bonus SP. Because you get basically ALL the SP from the leve, then when you retry after abandoning it, you get all that SP again. So double SP from one leve. You can't do that from crafting leves.

When I posted this thread under the Guildleve section I got alot of people claiming SE said it was OK to do, but none could point me to anywhere in the forums or lodestone where a post exists with them saying that. I'm not trying to argue if this is an "exploit" or not.

In my opinion it is contrary to the spirit of the game, and should be removed. All I'm looking for with this thread is someone from SE to confirm/deny and comment on it.

[solracht]

In all honesty, they should just make it so the leve disappears from the journal when you fail. I know it screws over some of the people who d/c but crafting works that way so why not? Its not very hero-esque to fail intentionally at the last minute

Last I checked I don't auto-fail a crafting leve if I logout or DC after activating it. That argument would be valid if you didn't auto-fail for disconnecting during battle leves.

[Jibe]

It's really simple. Some leves simply give more SP than others due to difficulty of mobs and their number like...Dunes, ACU, RR, Levinshower (those damn goats tend to pop for a long time lol).

When linked a few times, those leves can give you quite a lot of SP (900+ per mob).
Now people know that and tend to abandon leave at crystal (yes, intentionally fail it...with the option that we have) at last mob (or before, depends on leve), in order to have that same leve next cycle (leves you fail can be redone at crystal next leve reset, without the need to go back to counter and pick it up again).

Sometimes, when you fail the leave, you might also end up having it available at the counter next reset too, you can do it twice then.

There's no bonus next cycle, no extra SP or something like that...people simply want to repeat that same leve next time they reset.

Don't forget that players that do that also DO NOT receive reward, as that leve was failed.

Also bare in mind that this has nothing to do with that "haxing" where you could pop the mobs in leve till time runs out, this has nothing to do with that.

Thanks for fully explaining it to me. So you complete the leve, leaving one mob alive, getting all the SP for that leve. Then you intentionally abandon it. Next reset you can do the leve again and get full SP for every mob. Isn't that double SP from the same leve? With a chance at getting it and doing the same thing AGAIN on next reset?

IMO failing a leve intentionally is contrary to the spirit of ANY MMO and SE should change it so you can't do this. I'm really hoping to get someone from SE to post in this thread...

[Jibe]

Last I checked I don't auto-fail a crafting leve if I logout or DC after activating it. That argument would be valid if you didn't auto-fail for disconnecting during battle leves.

The argument is still valid. He's making a comparison, not an identity.

[Nipa]

What's the problem with giving all the bonus SP at the completing of the leve, and not during?

This would solve the problem (and it's how every other game does for quests: giving the xp reward at the end of the quest).

[Jibe]

What's the problem with giving all the bonus SP at the completing of the leve, and not during?

This would solve the problem (and it's how every other game does for quests: giving the xp reward at the end of the quest).

Ya that would solve the problem, but might be hard to implement. There was alot of blowback when this was mentioned in another thread too. I wouldn't be against it though.

[solracht]

If you think not dealing with the real problem is going to do anything, then think again. I agree that the way the system works right now is horrible for the game and completely backwards (I've posted a lot about it, actually), but you're not accomplishing anything unless you do a lot more.

The root of the problem is simple: most guildleves are horrible and a complete waste of time.

If you make it so guildleves can't be re-tried when you fail them, people will teleport to every guildleve counter every reset before choosing the 8 best guildleves.

If you make it so you can choose the 8 guildleves you want every reset (instead of the counter offering 3 random ones) people will still do the same 8 guildleves every reset, from rank 30 to rank 50, which is also horrible for the game.

[Zacko]

I'm really hoping to get someone from SE to post in this thread...

I would like them to say something too. Option is clearly there, I don't see any other purpose for it other than "intentionally failing leves". They must know what's going on in their game, and I'm confident that they do know people do that for a long time....why they haven't reacted to that so far...i guess we'll find out eventually.

[TheVedis]

Ok again, since this isnt the first time this has been brung up I will recap

1) The ability to redo failed leves was added on PURPOSE by the devs
2) the devs have specificaly stated its a reward vs type thing. We are sacrificing our reward to do it again for SP
3) the inferno "bug" where you get them to pop unlimited times is not related to this issue. What you are thinking of there is called an exploit, and it is bannable to do it on purpose.

So all in all, the fail on purpose thing is here to stay. It isnt an exploit. It is an "option" that was specificaly added back in november.

[Jibe]

I would like them to say something too. Option is clearly there, I don't see any other purpose for it other than "intentionally failing leves". They must know what's going on in their game, and I'm confident that they do know people do that for a long time....why they haven't reacted to that so far...i guess we'll find out eventually.

Ya, I'm not really here to come out and say "this is wrong don't do it". I'm mainly just wanting some comment from SE about it, and constructive ideas from other people on how a system could be in place where players would not WANT to intentionally fail leves. Because it is true that right now, they do it because there are only a few good leves. If they were all about equal in SP terms, they would not do it.