Japanese to English translation - Discussion Thread

[Tronic]

This whole debate is just confusing to me because it doesn't fit with my own experiences at all.
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Even so, I don't see how a role suddenly stops being as good between level 49 and level 50. It just doesn't make sense to me.....

It doesn't. WAR is awesome doing lvl 50 content like CM, Prae, AK and Ifrit and Garuda. In those fights nobody cares if you're a WAR or PLD. The WAR class is harder to play and additionally underpowered skill-wise compared to PLD, but with a good WAR playing you won't notice. I run those instances with my WAR because I find the class more fun to play precisely because it's harder and more engaging.

The problem starts with Titan and gets ugly in Coil. The damage you take grows much faster than the damage you dish, which determines your self heals. Titan fights? "Let the pally tank". "But hey, I'm a very good player and have great gear!" "Doesn't matter, he's easier to heal". Or "LF tank for Titan" "Hey, invite me, I'm a war!" "No thx, need pally, and we only take 1 tank".

I've done turn 1 in Coil with several groups and pallies are universally preferred. I have a relic and full DL gear except for 3 slots which are myth ilvl 90 pieces, and have around 7.2k health with defiance and without buffs. Last time I went with my FC and tanked. All night long the healers and dps were whining about how much easier the caduceus fight was with pallies instead of wars as tanks. And truly, we wiped often not because someone f*cked up but because the healers couldn't keep up. Wars don't have the EZ-mode buttons and massive passive mitigation that pallies get. And incoming damage scales even more as you go to turn 2 and beyond. For these reasons I'm levelling up a pally to play endgame content.

More seriously though: I'm far from endgame content but I was wondering, do Warriors still do more damage than Paladins even when they have Defiance up and the Paladins have Shield Oath up? Woud be kind of sad if in those conditions Paladins did more damage.

DPS is a bit higher too, but nothing to write home about. Theorycrafted damage in tanking stance is 5% - 10% higher with WAR.

[Eekiki]

keep your clothes on.

YOU CAN'T MAKE ME.

[HiirNoivl]

I did Coil with my group yesterday. I can do it just fine. I'm still wondering what the big deal is. No one in my group seems to care. We didn't clear Turn IV because we want to muddle about in Turn III and try to figure that out, but no one complained that I need more healing.

People prefer Pallies the same way they prefer BLMs and BRDs over MNK and DRG. These are also starting to get some undeserved ostracism (I read someone call them "useless jobs"). All the former classes let you be unskilled and not suffer much consequence. The only reason people take MNK and DRG to Titan is for the Limit Break.

Now we have MNK and DRG in our Coil parties, but people will set and wait for hours for 2 BRDs in Coil pick ups because they feel like they need them for silences even though they have 2 pallies for silences.

It's over insurance of a win because the skill level is low. But no one needs to make their parties like this. The issue is the same with WAR. People feel more secure of PLD because what they have been told. But I tell you that PLDs don't survive any better in an unskilled party than a WAR. If the party is skilled a WAR will survive just as well as a PLD. If the party is skilled and they prefer a PLD, the healers are just lazy, because it effects no one else in the party.

WARs are many times better players. Sometimes PLDs are lazy, not running out of stuff and eating everything, "because sentinel". As a WAR, I just don't get hit. Especially in Turn 2, you learn to be quick on your feet and run OUT of the red patterns on the floor. But 100% of the PLDs I've run with just stand in it.

But no one thinks I'm a possibility as a WAR because I'm harder to heal. But they've never played with me. I feel that WAR is fine, but we need a better statement from the devs, but even then it's at the point where no one will believe it. That horse has left the barn and WAR will carry this stigma was the rest of the life of the game I fear.

[Rivienne]

People prefer Pallies the same way they prefer BLMs and BRDs over MNK and DRG.
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As a WAR, I just don't get hit. Especially in Turn 2, you learn to be quick on your feet and run OUT of the red patterns on the floor. But 100% of the PLDs I've run with just stand in it.
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That horse has left the barn and WAR will carry this stigma was the rest of the life of the game I fear.

This is what I am worried about too. First off monks are my favourite DPS class by far. I have run with some bad ones, but the good ones are always amazing. With a good WAR and MNK in the party, it is always a smoother run. Second, Bards on the other hand are my least favourite class to work with. In theory they are great, but I rarely see it. (Dragoon, I have only come across occasionally, so I don't have a good feel for them yet.)

Also on the aoe thing: in general I think a lot of PLD seem to have a worse off understanding of what happens after mitigation. They seem to think that mitigation means they don't get hurt at all so if they die it is all on the healer, which is only partly true. I actually had to tell a PLD once in stone vigil(?) to stop standing in aoe or I was going to run out of MP before the end no matter how much mitigation he had because my MP is limited. Similarly, my worst runs of Hauke are always PLD who stay in the aoe and try and take it. Obviously there are slower players as well as inexperienced, but the AOE thing seems common enough that I think it must be something that simply isn't learned well for that particular job especially not early enough on to become habit.

[Soukyuu]

Well... all I can say is, this is how I felt back in 1.0 playing MNK. The prejudices about how instances were "impossible" with MNK were rampant and everyone told you to "just play ARC/LNC" Now it's another class that is carrying this stigma. I don't think it will ever change, it will always hit some class, you just realize it more when it hits you. You just have to find people worth partying with.

[Reinheart]

Well... all I can say is, this is how I felt back in 1.0 playing MNK. The prejudices about how instances were "impossible" with MNK were rampant and everyone told you to "just play ARC/LNC" Now it's another class that is carrying this stigma. I don't think it will ever change, it will always hit some class, you just realize it more when it hits you. You just have to find people worth partying with.

Yep it's basically this, if you can find good friends/people that will let you play with any class YOU want to play is the best.
I leveled every battle class in 1.0 to prep for any types of parties but my favorite will and always will be Warrior. (Favorite job from FF1,3,5 - before Ninja's and Blue Mages and Suppin.. lol)

[Doki]

Regardless of how you feel, and what you know: If you limit yourself to one class because it's your favorite, you're going to have a bad time. YES, you CAN do all these things you want on X job, but you will fight an uphill battle unless you have a good group of like-minded people. Level ALL your jobs. Be flexible. Patches often change the landscape greatly and it's possible your favorite will have it's day in the spotlight... but today is not that day.

[ReplicaX]

I play WAR but my wife as WHM hates it, she says she needs to heal more than when I'm running as a PLD.
I don't like playing PLD, WAR feels so much better for me >< Still stuck on Chimera for my Bravura... need to find a group for it... lol /sigh

It is sad, that some of the community is stuck in this stigma. I've had no issues running with WARs on Titan just to get them their well deserved clears as any other. As a Brd I'm not tossing up anymore than BV+Ballad after heart so Mages have MP on Final Phase. If I'm adding another Ballad in Final phase, its because ppl are taking avoidable dmg.

[Soukyuu]

Regardless of how you feel, and what you know: If you limit yourself to one class because it's your favorite, you're going to have a bad time. YES, you CAN do all these things you want on X job, but you will fight an uphill battle unless you have a good group of like-minded people. Level ALL your jobs. Be flexible. Patches often change the landscape greatly and it's possible your favorite will have it's day in the spotlight... but today is not that day.

It's not about being flexible in this case, really. All you have to level is one of each role. That's enough flexibility right there.

There is really no reason to struggle leveling a class you can't identify yourself with. If you can't, then you will be bad at it, and/or won't enjoy playing the game - and that's what the game ultimately is about.

[Gilthas]

Its interesting that while they say that they will be adding more spots where Karakuls spawn, in the case of Banemites they just mention adjusting their spawn rate. I hope they don't mean that they'll be decreasing the spawn rate.

Regardless, at least on Phoenix, the main problem with Banemates is the bot farming. As long as they take care of those, farming Banemites honestly isn't that bad since regular players don't really monopolize the farming spots for long.