BLM

[Vindicate]

Is it worth socketing +crit rate materia into the gear? For I know, we have one of the lowest crit rates basically, does anyone know if its worth it or just socket determination?

The potency of the Thundercloud Procs is determined about the base hit potency of each Thunder Skill and its over time damage.
Thunder 3 does more initial damage and lasts 3 seconds longer, which is in fact 1 tick, thats where this high potency comes from.
Same for Thunder 2 compared to 1.

[Allyrion]

i think more than most here are assuming hardcasting a higher rank spell will do more overall damage
this is incorrect

I cast Thunder III cause it looks better.
I'm also fairly certain things like trying to hold out a thundercloud proc to reduce dot clipping or maximizing your firestarter procs by interrupting your fire 1 casts (or especially blizzard III when going into regen) makes a much bigger dps difference than this.

The tooltip on the thundercloud buff implies square probably meant for thundercloud to be determined by what was hard casting. If it's not that in-game, they'll probably fix it.
Thunder 2 hardcast + Thunder 3 thundercloud proc might add something interesting if the proc wasn't so damned low. I think this whole debate is a bit overstated, even for serious min-maxers.

[Nyel]

i think more than most here are assuming hardcasting a higher rank spell will do more overall damage
this is incorrect

That is an issue caused by awful localisation.

In most of the FF games ( maybe in every? ) you always replace your magical attacks - Fire 2 replaces Fire 1 ( or Feura replaces Feuer, don't know the actual English terms - Fire, Firera? ), Vitra replaces Vitra etc.

BUT in this game, all of these spells are different. Fire 2 is not just Fire 1 with more potency, it is a different attack. So with Cure 1 and Cure 2 and every other spell.

That's quite a big mistake they made when developing the game in German or English.

[HoroBoro]

Further testing on dummies also shows that a Thunder III thundercloud proc does more damage than a Thunder thundercloud proc. In my case, Thunder III does around ~750 dmg, whereas Thunder only does ~500 dmg.

That's good information - I'll have to do tests myself, but if it's true I'll have to change my setup.

I cast Thunder III cause it looks better.

100% agree. I'd like a Master Spark BM skill... very, very disappointed there's none currently.

[SuperZykra]

Actually ACN is not required, I only leveled my archer to 15 and got my BMG unlocked. I assume its either or in this case.

[gigarit]

There is actually a guide I've been working on over at Ffxivrealm.com, I'll just leave the link here hopefully some of you find it helpful!

http://ffxivrealm.com/threads/black-...-2#post-112880

[FlareBronwen]

Actually ACN is not required, I only leveled my archer to 15 and got my BMG unlocked. I assume its either or in this case.

Only archer unlocks black mage. I read that it was ACN when I first started in beta 4. After I got my THM to 25, I took a break and leveled ACN to 15. When I got lvl 30 THM, the job quest was red saying I needed level 15 ARC for BLM. I'm not complaining though, at least I had Psysick early on.

[Dale]

I can vouch for that. My Arcanist was only level 3 when I unlocked Black Mage. All you need is Archer 15. Which is dumb in my opinion. What does an Archer have to do with a Black Mage? Arcanist would definitely make more sense. But that isn't the case.

[Foullacy]

I cast Thunder III cause it looks better.
I'm also fairly certain things like trying to hold out a thundercloud proc to reduce dot clipping or maximizing your firestarter procs by interrupting your fire 1 casts (or especially blizzard III when going into regen) makes a much bigger dps difference than this.

The tooltip on the thundercloud buff implies square probably meant for thundercloud to be determined by what was hard casting. If it's not that in-game, they'll probably fix it.
Thunder 2 hardcast + Thunder 3 thundercloud proc might add something interesting if the proc wasn't so damned low. I think this whole debate is a bit overstated, even for serious min-maxers.

If you read the tooltips for Thunder I - III you would see that the potency increases with each rank that is hard cast to trigger Thundercloud.

That being said, it is still optimal to use Thunder I because it syncs up with the final tick of regen in Umbral Ice allowing you to maximize your casts of Fire. If you're casting Thunder II or III during regen phase you're clipping regen and wasting time you could be casting Fire instead.

Now if you went into regen phase with Firestarter, you would probably see a DPS increase using Thunder II over Thunder I since you have to hold off on Fire III for a few seconds to get the final tick of regen. Consuming Firestarter before regen phase is ideal because if you hard cast Fire III with 3 stacks of Umbral Ice you can cheat a hastened Fire.

[Thyrllan]

If you read the tooltips for Thunder I - III you would see that the potency increases with each rank that is hard cast to trigger Thundercloud.

The tooltip is flawed.

Thunder I -> Thundercloud proc my Thunder III hits for avg 711, low 691, high 739
Thunder III -> Thundercloud proc my Thunder III hits for avg 706, low 696, high 735

Differing numbers, but not large enough to be worth 100 potency. Thundercloud's potency is dependent on which Thunder you spend the proc on. For fun I hardcasted TIII and used the proc on TI, it hit for 495