[Loremonger] 1.X Lominsan Story Arc

[Anonymoose]

Can anyone translate this for me?

I've just realized that every single language translates the Sthalmann / H'naanza discussion in an entirely different way.

In English, Sthalmann arrests a one-eyed captain whose passenger ship is really a pirate ship and H'naanza suggests that the sea serpent appeared because this ship carries more than passengers...

You mean pirate ship. I locked up the crew for questioning the moment they dropped anchor in the bay. We've been trying to extract a confession from that one-eyed captain of theirs, but so far neither he nor any of his crew seem susceptible to the standard forms of coercion

In French, Sthalmann arrests Carvallian, but can't find enough evidence on his pirate ship to finally execute him. H'naanza suggests that perhaps it carries more than passengers, explaining why the sea serpent appeared.

Un bateau pirate, oui. Pour pouvoir enfin passer la corde au cou de Carvallain, je l'ai coffré avec tout son équipage, mais nosinterrogatoires n'ont encore rien donné.

A pirate ship, yes. To finally pass the noose around Carvallain's neck, I locked up his whole crew, but our interrogations have given us nothing.

In German, Sthalmann interrogates the crew of a smuggler's ship hoping to get to "their leader," but doesn't get enough out of the crew to lead to him and H'naanza simply wonders why the serpent would appear nearby...

Ah, du meinst das Schmugglerschiff, das als ein normales Fahrgastschiff getarnt ist.Ich hatte gehofft, diesmal ihren Anführer dranzukriegen. Aber obwohl alle Matrosen an Bord in die Mangel genommen wurden, ließ sich kein eindeutiger Hinweis finden, der zu diesem Ganoven geführt hätte.

Ah, you mean the smuggler ship, disguised as a normal passenger ship. I'd hoped to finally apprehend their leader. However, though the entire crew has been thoroughly interrogated, we have no clear evidence leading to this crook.

In Japanese, ... well, I can't read it. Can someone help?

H'naanza:
ああ、船員になりすまして、客船に乗り込んでいたんですってね。

Ahh, ____________________

Sthalmann:
客船を装った密輸船だ。
今度こそ、あの野郎を吊してやれると見込んで 船員を全員、引っ張ったんだが上手くいかん。

It is a smuggler ship posing as a passenger ship.
______________________________________________.

H'naanza
その船ですが、本当ですか？
大海蛇が現れたとかなんとか…

_________________.
The great sea serpent appeared and somehow...

I THINK Sthalmann is admitting that, in Shapeless Melody he disguised himself and snuck aboard a pirate ship in order to obtain evidence against its captain. If this is true, we can write off a lot of the assumptions I made to make the story fit and we can (finally) start restricting the boundaries of speculation.

The thing is... whose ship was he on? English seems to imply the Astalicia, captained by one-eyed Hyllfyr. French flat out says it's Carvallian's ship, so the Misery is implied. German makes no attempt to identify anyone by name - and neither does the Japanese, for that matter, but if we can confirm that Sthalmann is confirming that he was undercover on that ship, then we can field-strip my entire theory and rebuild it.

[Mjollnir]

I wonder how much of the story is different for the different regions, past small nuances of language. It's going to make theorycrafting a royal pain if the different clients relate the game events differently!

Now though, it just seems that the minutiae are causing confusion due to minor oversights, rather than being intricate plot details... Oh woe!

Also, how can The Misery crew be under arrest when, at the end of the conversation, Sthalmann goes off to the battle at Seal Rock which The Misery used as a cover to escape with Emeric and the horn? Silly Frenchies.

[Anonymoose]

I wonder how much of the story is different for the different regions, past small nuances of language. It's going to make theorycrafting a royal pain if the different clients relate the game events differently!

Not much. Just in case, I've been going through different websites and blogs translating everything that came out vague into all four languages. For the most part, they're about the same. There's different turns of phrase and pop culture references, but overall it's the same - though, I have to say, English by far has the most flavor.

There are, as you say, a few occasions where it seems there were slip-ups, though. Also in Treasures of the Main, there's a scene at Oschon's Torch where, in an Echo, Travanchet and Emerick are responsible for the death of a few pullers at the lighthouse where they're having their meeting. When you come back from the Echo, Sisipu refers to the massacre at her home village of Brookhaven as the inspiration for why she's so afraid right now - but as far as I can tell, the attack on Brookhaven and the death of the Oschon's Torch pullers are entirely separate incidents. For instance, it is at Brookhaven that Sisipu sees the Sahagin (beastmen) talk to Emerick, and at Oschon's Torch we hear only of the Serpent Reavers blamed.

Also, how can The Misery crew be under arrest when, at the end of the conversation, Sthalmann goes off to the battle at Seal Rock which The Misery used as a cover to escape with Emeric and the horn? Silly Frenchies.

Well, it seems like he didn't end up with any useable evidence against anyone - but still, this whole thing eludes me. I'm going to pause my efforts and do the full functional transcripts of Legends Adrift and Never the Twain Shall Meet, instead, and hope I gain some insight.

If, by then, there are no answers, I'll sum it all up and start begging.

[HiirNoivl]

#1 What is the setting of the Shapeless Melody Echo? (Whose ship in what year?)
It’s possible that we moved ships due to Rostnsthal’s memory. Hob’s ship and the Astalicia are the only two that look exactly like this in the game so far – is it one of these, or a third? Is it 1562 as Y'shtola is investigating, as it seems to be when Thancred is investigating Limsa?

I think you mean When Thancred is investigating Ul'dah

[Anonymoose]

I think you mean When Thancred is investigating Ul'dah

Man, of the 50 times I type that correctly, the one time I save it is wrong. Curse you, Murphy! (But thank you, Hiir. There's going to be temporary mistakes and typos galore as I get this nonsense together, so I wholeheartedly encourage people to correct and question to their hearts' content. I'm sure I can pull a quote out if I was right all along :P)

[HiirNoivl]

Man, of the 50 times I type that correctly, the one time I save it is wrong. Curse you, Murphy! (But thank you, Hiir. There's going to be temporary mistakes and typos galore as I get this nonsense together, so I wholeheartedly encourage people to correct and question to their hearts' content. I'm sure I can pull a quote out if I was right all along :P)

Thank you for giving me something to read.

It's a great story, it's a shame that we have to bust our rears to make hide-or-hair of it.

Someone mentioned that the "Twelve" maybe physical manifestations or even may actually BE the people from the Circle of Knowing. I think it's safe to say that at least they're Archons and are closely related. I think Y'shtola's efforts to get the key may have been connected to the release of the primals and the prohibition of their summoning. If it's true that they are closely related to the Twelve then they would have an interest in seeing that the Mother Crystal's aether wasn't consumed by other entities, seeing as summoning "the Twelve" to prevent Dalamud would have consumed as much.

Since they are essentially the "good Primals" (See Thancred's speech on "living on a prayer" about the similarities between the Twelve and the The Primals) and they have "Archons", I think it would be reasonable to speculate that the "Bad Primals" (Ifrit, et al.) would have Archon's (The Paragons) too. That the Primals were locked away and sealed by the Circle of Knowing probably might be an interesting theory too, but I don't really know much about that.

Hydalyn's awakening of the echo would be an appropriate response to a watershed moment that involves her very life. Awakening the Echo may have been an act of self preservation because it basically helped prevent the Circle of Knowing as well as the Ascian's (or their pawns) from fighting directly since you manage to screw over both their plans (Gridania is still a bit shadowy) in all three cities.

As a result, the calling of Dalamud by the Darnus may be an Ascian plot to get rid of The Player specifically and they almost succeed were it not for Louisoux's contingency plan. If Y'shtola time warped to 5 years later in her quest to oppose the Ascian's again, it's likely that she'll be looking specifically for you...

And it's also likely that the Ascian's will be looking for you too.

I'm looking forward to the special cutscene that all the players brought forward will receive.

[HiirNoivl]

Regarding you theory on this. I have been thinking, just how the Primals you meet always tell you not to summon the others.

I've always felt that the Primals telling you not to summon other Primals was the same as why the Circle of Knowing tells you not to summon them. It eats aether, which is apparently somewhat of a finite resource though some can be returned to the planet, which is why Hydalyn isn't totally wasted in ARR.

Primals want to have all that power to themselves so they can stay in the world. The Circle of Knowing appears to care about the planet too but they also would not like to see more primals summoned.

Regarding the Ascian, Travenchet, he doesn't appear to be entirely of this world either, considering that light appears to pass right through him instead of creating a shadow behind. Perhaps Primals and Ascians have a shared story and origin.

It's just that in the Limsa storyline, it's the only time where we really get to see them so it's hard to say anything about them.

The Echo-giver on the other hand, snatches you out of your ordinary life, appears to deliberately put you in places to prevent the Twain from ever Meeting. I don't think Y'shtola was looking to find the shadowless associate to share pleasantries.

I'm sure a war between those two probably would have been some bad news.

[Orophin]

Well there's definitely some inconsistencies. Caravallain doesn't wear an eye patch, nor does Hyllfyr. (regarding the one-eyed captain thing) It's strange that the French version outright names Caravallain though. I think he'd make more sense over Hyllfyr though as the latter seems to be trying to keep a low profile, while it's mentioned in the last Marauder quest that Rostnstahl finds this book that details Caravallain's dealings. I'm sure human smuggling could be among those things.

[Anonymoose]

Well there's definitely some inconsistencies. Caravallain doesn't wear an eye patch, nor does Hyllfyr. (regarding the one-eyed captain thing)

At the very least, Hyllfyr's nickname is One-eyed Hyllfyr. He has both eyes, so I assume that he chose the nickname himself so a parallel would be drawn between him and the legendary pirate One-eyed Wylfred.

It's strange that the French version outright names Caravallain though. I think he'd make more sense over Hyllfyr though as the latter seems to be trying to keep a low profile, while it's mentioned in the last Marauder quest that Rostnstahl finds this book that details Caravallain's dealings. I'm sure human smuggling could be among those things.

You think that's confusing? In Legends Adrift, Sthalmann comes aboard the Astalicia and demands Carvallian... and then tells him he runs a strict ship. What? That's Hyllfyr's ship!

But then I checked the other languages... English is the only language in which Sthalmann says, "You run a strict ship, Captain" to Carvallian aboard the Astalicia. All three other languages simply say, "It seems the Astalicia requires very specific ettiquette."

There are most definitely some discrepancies between languages - I'm not sure if I'll be able to sort them all out. Once I have all four quests in the OP, if we still can't sort it out, I'll start begging for assistance. By that point, answering the questions should be as easy for someone at SE as just going, #1) Name #2) Yes #3) Plot Mechanism etc. etc.

In the meantime, I encourage any attempts to answer questions. I'll bring in quotes and different translations of anything anyone wants to get the gears grinding.

The unfortunate fact seems to be that during 1.X's early development, there was a crunch to get it done fast and not enough inter-communication synchrony; and it wasn't without a few casualties. The good news is that I'm a stubborn bastard - we'll get there.