Job Leveling / Separate Idenity

[Mjollnir]

Just my opinion, but I thought the crystarium in FFXIII sucked. It seemed completely pointless, just something to make me hold a button down every now an then.

It was very pretty though!

[Lady]

It was very pretty though!

You have me there. It was VERY pretty lol

[fusional]

It was very pretty though!

ahahaha

but so was ffxiv 1.0 ;o

[Reika]

Just my opinion, but I thought the crystarium in FFXIII sucked. It seemed completely pointless, just something to make me hold a button down every now an then.

I thought only I did that!!!

[Shougun]

Just my opinion, but I thought the crystarium in FFXIII sucked. It seemed completely pointless, just something to make me hold a button down every now an then.

They let you hold down the button because there were no levels, certainly they could remove that portion (and just be instant). I think in FFXIV sake with soul stones the crystarium could make a lot of lore sense (sphere grid could work but doesnt really capture that crystalline structure).

If you want to make it a talent tree the crystarium could be crazy amazing - the 3d elements would be most interesting imo.

However its just fine with any visual leveling system, I only think visual leveling systems would help because you can explain why the job diverges from the class. "Oh I see here my visual leveling system has told me I took CNJ cure and stoneskin, but I didnt take this, oh and I see that I got these new passives and abilities, oh and I can get this CNJ spell with a WHM twist here..."


Its all very easy to absorb imo. Compared to a some tooltip that lists out all the changes. Or worse yet, no information on the changes and just every level you get the most inconsistent scheme ever.

You have me there. It was VERY pretty lol

Yes my precious..

[Dzian]

whats the point in having jobs?.

Jobs were created to give classes identities.

mnk is not the same as pug

not quite but near as damn it. save for 1 or 2 abilities they both play pretty much identically.

which ultimately was the original problem with classes. there was a set of skills and that set of skills you would use whether you were pugilist lancer marauder gladiator or archer. all classes were basically identical.

Jobs exist to create diversity and variety where classes failed.

[Mychael]

Jobs exist to create diversity and variety where classes failed.

However, they fixed [aka limited] classes to differentiate them, then threw jobs on top as overkill.

Also, I'd like to disagree with your use of "diversity" and "variety." Pre-reform classes allowed each player to pick their own set of abilities, i.e. every player was diverse. Post-reform, everyone has one of the predefined skillsets.

[indira]

If all skills changed it would help out logically, because only some changing would be a logical inconsistency that would look like the dev didnt polish the game. But then how would you make the white mage adopt cure without changing it?

I suppose you could make the Jobs their own but only take 5 skills from classes (so the ratio is flipped).


Also this grid/cryst/sphere system lets Jobs level on their own - making the duo jobs from class system possible for two reasons 1 jobs can be their own 2 jobs are further their own as they level on their own

thats thinking in the same old box, reason why some many games in general are clone with different graphics. people keep wanting the same old systems that already exist. and you can change anything.

they need to make classes = jobs other wise no one will care for the classes when they get the job.
either way nothing like that is gonna happen this game is being made for quick play, days of the time sinks are dead.

[indira]

Jobs were created to give classes identities.


not quite but near as damn it. save for 1 or 2 abilities they both play pretty much identically.

which ultimately was the original problem with classes. there was a set of skills and that set of skills you would use whether you were pugilist lancer marauder gladiator or archer. all classes were basically identical.

Jobs exist to create diversity and variety where classes failed.

monk is kung fu asian, pug boxer western

gladiator fighter, paladin holy knight

archer bow shooting guy, bard plays music

and so on.

you can make them way different, i call the team lazy in that aspect of making classes/jobs.

[Shougun]

thats thinking in the same old box, reason why some many games in general are clone with different graphics. people keep wanting the same old systems that already exist. and you can change anything.

they need to make classes = jobs other wise no one will care for the classes when they get the job.
either way nothing like that is gonna happen this game is being made for quick play, days of the time sinks are dead.

A, a level system like that has really never (that I know of) been put into an mmorpg
B, what is different then just making classes lead directly into jobs and making the classes useless that isnt the same old box

Within the idea I suggested jobs diverge from classes but classes can still exist.

Jobs would obtain ALL of their abilities from their visual leveling system, while classes would level the normal way. Classes would continue to be required not only to develop jobs and make jobs but also because they would have a superior freedom, as jobs again would never adopt things "just because" it would only be added to the grid when the dev though that particular ability should be added.

In a matter in box out of box, its out of the box (but messy, having two different leveling systems is not merit wise is unheard of (again, that I know of).

In the box thinking is to suggest that we should just make classes lead to jobs.

Edit: Your next post makes it obvious that you meant that all things are jobs. I thought you meant Classes -> Jobs kinda of like it is.

I still dont know how you feel that is out of the box thinking and yet what I suggested is "cloning" other mmorpgs. Which have never done it. Though again I think the best idea is to start them all their own similar to the true FFT, FFXI system but that isnt out of the box.. its just preferred.