So Devs...Are we going to rule with an iron fist this time around?

[IndigoDarkwolf]

XI's crew having to hire someone to solely monitor in-game transactions was simply asinine and a show that there was something wrong with the game if RMT could thrive there, and that the developers were willing to do everything but fix things.

Going to have to disagree with you on that one. Find me an MMO that hasn't had a problem with RMT, and I'll show you an MMO that was never released to the public, or that nobody played.

[Duelle]

Going to have to disagree with you on that one. Find me an MMO that hasn't had a problem with RMT, and I'll show you an MMO that was never released to the public, or that nobody played.

I didn't know WoW was privately run and was played by nobody...

[xXHalloweenTrixXx]

I didn't know WoW was privately run and was played by nobody...

...What? ...

[Duelle]

...What? ...

I guess I'll reiterate what I said earlier in this thread.

If the other standard MMOs are any indication, RMT won't have much of a leg to stand on so long as the developers keep control over progression. RMT was stupidly trivial in WoW because almost all of the character progression is tied to PvP via arena points or BoP gear via raids. They got so desperate that they started making lv1 alts, running them to the city to shout ads for their RMT company, after which everyone in the zone would report them for spamming and continue with their day.

In plain english: Because of how progression in WoW worked, you could not buy success with gold. Which then equates to a weaker market for RMT due to a decreased demand. The fact the game was designed in such a way that there wasn't much they could truly exploit really helped.

Sure, they were still around, and the extremely lazy could actually buy from them, but all that gold at the most would get you an over-priced rare mount or some super rare pet. As I said, we mostly reported them for spam and moved on, seeing that their presence was trivial (which means that no, we weren't throwing fits like some of you do over RMT) and did not impede in the gameplay experience of others.

Now compare that to games like Lineage II and FFXI, both of which had venues they could exploit and thus contribute to inflation while creating demand for what they sell. RMT used to appropriate themselves of certain areas in Lineage II with decent money drops and the super rare crafting mats helped them even more. FFXI had them camping NMs with drops that sold for very high prices, appropriated themselves of supplying for crafts (not to mention those that camped the guild shops for rare mats that ended up in the AH at least 4 times the standard price, though normal players were guilty of this as well). Both games were designed in such a way that they had a field day, and they did.

[IndigoDarkwolf]

Because of how progression in WoW worked, you could not buy success with gold. Which then equates to a weaker market for RMT due to a decreased demand. The fact the game was designed in such a way that there wasn't much they could truly exploit really helped.

I understand what you're trying to say about how an MMO's design can contribute to or discourage RMTs. It's hardly fair to criticize FFXI for having support reps on hand to identify RMTs, though, since WoW most definitely has the same kind of people. So does EVE Online, Lineage II, and basically any MMO where the developers actually care at all.

If the game has a way of trading currency for something of value, then it will have an RMT problem. If WoW's gold was really worthless, there wouldn't be an auction house.

Really, what developers can do well to help themselves is make it easy for players to report RMTs including a trustworthy chat log, and to record market and trade activity. Really, the more time they spend on tools to help players participate in policing and to help their reps investigate reports, the more success they're going to have fighting RMTs. I suspect WoW has very good tools these days, so RMTs get shut down quickly, making it more lucrative for them to go exploit other games.

[Duelle]

I understand what you're trying to say about how an MMO's design can contribute to or discourage RMTs. It's hardly fair to criticize FFXI for having support reps on hand to identify RMTs, though, since WoW most definitely has the same kind of people. So does EVE Online, Lineage II, and basically any MMO where the developers actually care at all.

Indeed, but the most RMT ever interacted with you in WoW was when they would sent you tells with the url to their website or if they started spamming adds in trade chat. And as I said, everyone would just report them for spam and move on.

I used to get PK'd by gangs of RMT in the days of Lineage II, because the moment you weren't convenient to have around they would log on in droves and greatly outnumber you (fighting off Wolves1-12, Lions1-12 and so on). FFXI had instances of MPKing from RMT (much like players MPKd RMT as well). I already mentioned NM camps and crafting supplies.

As I said earlier, XI's developers (this was back under Tanaka) refused to see that their "difficulty" (read: tediousness and timesinks gallore) made it easier for RMT to thrive between time available, manpower, and the community's pressure on the average player that didn't want to spend ten hours farming beehive chips to buy the overpriced gear he was expected to have for exp parties. Rather than say "well, our system is fucked up and is encouraging and letting RMT thrive. Maybe we should change some stuff so that RMT becomes trivial and looses their stranglehold on the game", they said "let's pay someone just to monitor game transactions and change nothing!". Even now I get annoyed at thinking about it because they glossed over the problem entirely. And as I said, I'm not a fan of witch hunts.

[valetarkus]

And as I said, I'm not a fan of witch hunts.

Dude i love burning witches. it's my favorite past time.

[xXHalloweenTrixXx]

Indeed, but the most RMT ever interacted with you in WoW was when they would sent you tells with the url to their website or if they started spamming adds in trade chat. And as I said, everyone would just report them for spam and move on.

I used to get PK'd by gangs of RMT in the days of Lineage II, because the moment you weren't convenient to have around they would log on in droves and greatly outnumber you (fighting off Wolves1-12, Lions1-12 and so on). FFXI had instances of MPKing from RMT (much like players MPKd RMT as well). I already mentioned NM camps and crafting supplies.

As I said earlier, XI's developers (this was back under Tanaka) refused to see that their "difficulty" (read: tediousness and timesinks gallore) made it easier for RMT to thrive between time available, manpower, and the community's pressure on the average player that didn't want to spend ten hours farming beehive chips to buy the overpriced gear he was expected to have for exp parties. Rather than say "well, our system is fucked up and is encouraging and letting RMT thrive. Maybe we should change some stuff so that RMT becomes trivial and looses their stranglehold on the game", they said "let's pay someone just to monitor game transactions and change nothing!". Even now I get annoyed at thinking about it because they glossed over the problem entirely. And as I said, I'm not a fan of witch hunts.

And you know what... I prefer them providing something than -nothing- at all.

They provided a team to specifically deal with RMTs, sure it may not be the exact fix to your problem but it was something to help thwart the plague of bots.

People tend to not be grateful for the little things. I guess you preferred nothing.

[IndigoDarkwolf]

Going to have to disagree with you on that one. Find me an MMO that hasn't had a problem with RMT, and I'll show you an MMO that was never released to the public, or that nobody played.

I didn't know WoW was privately run and was played by nobody...

*snirk*WoW has never had a problem with RMT, never ev... *snort* No, I'm sorry, I just can't say that with a straight face. I'm sorry, I really am, but I just can't.

[SkyeWindbinder]

I didn't know WoW was privately run and was played by nobody...

Uh... have you ever played WoW? lol