"You Will Die" Difficulty... Can I Have It?

[Kinseykinz]

ehhh. yes and no. in THAT GAME WHICH SHALL NOT BE MENTIONED, hardmodes almost categorically changed how fights worked, to the extent that if you were working on the hardmode you were essentially learning an almost entirely new fight. yeah the boss is the same, and it's in the same zone, but the behavior was very different, the strategy was very different and the loot was either different or upgraded versions of the normal loot.

if all they're doing is increasing HP/defense/regen/attack and making environmental hazards cover more ground or hit harder, then it is a bit gimmicky and definitely qualifies as recycling content. but it can absolutely be done right, where you're only fighting the same boss in name alone.

I meant it more along the lines you're discribing

Beat easy version. Work on new strategy/clear for normal version. Beat normal... start working on strategy and clear of hard...etc. sorry for the lack of clarity. My bigger point is that I'd prefer the battle to just be 'hardmode' from the beginning, no difficulity sliders needed. I'd rather they add a variety of content across all skill levels than fewer actual things to do, but more ways to basically beat the same content.

As to the PUGS, I honestly think JA's are more selective in who they PUG with than NA's and are willing to spend more time building a party than we are...that and they stick in the PUG much longer, agree to meet back again if making progress etc. We aren't typically as proactive and patient. Don't take this as facts...just what I've noticed since playing

[fusional]

I meant it more along the lines you're discribing

Beat easy version. Work on new strategy/clear for normal version. Beat normal... start working on strategy and clear of hard...etc. sorry for the lack of clarity. My bigger point is that I'd prefer the battle to just be 'hardmode' from the beginning, no difficulity sliders needed. I'd rather they add a variety of content across all skill levels than fewer actual things to do, but more ways to basically beat the same content.

understood.

i think it depends a lot on the progression of endgame, and just how many options there are. another thing about WoW to consider is that there were 25 man raids, and it took a while to totally gear up everyone in your guild. as with any MMO, then, you were stuck farming the same stuff for quite a while until everyone was properly geared, but some players outgeared others.

what was to keep them from just getting sick of the grind and not logging in again until a new expansion?

hardmodes were the answer. they could revisit the content, effectively learn a new fight with a fresh challenge, and stay interested a bit longer while the rest of their guild caught up. and there were generally perks to go along with it (higher item level gear, new trinkets, etc)

it's a tough line to walk, sure. people get tired of the grind, the endless gear treadmill, and developers of new MMOs have tried to take some of the grind away and streamline the process. but as we can see, the games which are retaining subscribers are the ones that have kept to the treadmill tradition, and the new games trying to revolutionize this fade quickly.

(or in some instances they still have the traditional grind, but not enough stuff to grind for)

so on one hand, i don't want content to be recycled. i don't want to get sick of it. i don't want to feel like i'm running in place for ages. but on the other hand i don't want to suffer from "been there, done that" after just a few short months, either.

[Altena]

As to the PUGS, I honestly think JA's are more selective in who they PUG with than NA's and are willing to spend more time building a party than we are...that and they stick in the PUG much longer, agree to meet back again if making progress etc. We aren't typically as proactive and patient. Don't take this as facts...just what I've noticed since playing

100% agreed with this Kinsey !

I am in Australia so my time zone is practically the same as JP's. I have found from my experience that they are a lot more reluctant to party with an EN player (potentially due to the language barrier, but to be honest I think it has a lot to do with the way some EN players treat them). I however was lucky enough to party with a particular JP group that were a little more open to EN players and they were quite selective, polite, and very different to my EN experiences

They had a much higher tolerance level, more persistence and they did indeed agree to continue at a later date.