Level Progression/Questing

[Zumi]

#3 is not really an option if it is not efficient, which is potentially the problem. Having the option to do something but it being completely pointless is not really an option at all. Just like in WoW you can level up only killing mobs never questing or running a dungeon... but it would be stupid.

Sounds like you haven't played WoW currently. Actually grinding mobs in WoW is the fastest way to level in WoW. Just that nobody does it because it takes a group and a vast amount of knowledge about monster spawns around the world. All the world first level 80, 85, 90, or even server firsts are obtained by grinding mobs.

For example in the newest expansion MoP someone went from 85-90 in 5 hours, many server first level 90s were done on grinding mobs, questing takes like 1-2 weeks on average for your normal person. Only extreme hardcore people grinded mobs cause its really mind numbing and takes some coordination to have a group together. People will go to spots where higher level mobs spawn 89-90.

In cataclysm the guy who got the world first 80-85 did it by grinding mobs that respawned fast in Twilight Highlands.

The main factor is most casual players in WoW will not grind mobs because its easier just to quest solo or dungeon queue then find a group of people your level to grind mobs even though its the fastest way to level. People would rather spend 2 weeks getting from 85-90 rather then 1, 10 hour exp mob grind session, which really only the super hardcore do.

[Biggs]

Have to remember there are a Lot and I mean a LOT of people who hate questing.

Those people should prob stop playing Rpg's altogether then and go play baseball or something. Thats like saying I hate sunshine but love a good beach vacation.

Also, hasn't Yoshi said something like 30 times that you will have multiple ways of leveling. Nm hunts, ect? I just grow tired of people picking and choosing what they hear and read and then reacting to it. Its like taking something out of context and then spending 4 hours talking about it. These people need to all go work for Fox news and get out of our forums

I have no problem with constructive critisism, but most of the responses I read in the Alpha 5 thread were anything but.

[Chardrizard]

I think the main thing people want is options. We shouldn't be locked down into being forced to questing like GW2 and newer MMOs do, nor forced to grind like they days of old.

Also, hi noc. I miss you.

I didnt know GW2 forced you to do questing. If anything GW2 is probably the less painful levelling system i have ever experienced, i hit 80 without noticing while exploring the world.

In GW2 you can level 1-80 entirely doing WvW (World vs World, big scale rape enemies taking castle siege)
you can also level 1-80 levelling up crafts.
you can also level 30-80 entirely from dungeons (One dungeons done nets you 80% of your current level exp bar)
you can also quest of course.
alternatively, you can stand in one area doing dynamic events that chains alot like FATE-like system.

[KiriA500]

I didnt know GW2 forced you to do questing. If anything GW2 is probably the less painful levelling system i have ever experienced, i hit 80 without noticing while exploring the world.

In GW2 you can level 1-80 entirely doing WvW (World vs World, big scale rape enemies taking castle siege)
you can also level 1-80 levelling up crafts.
you can also level 30-80 entirely from dungeons (One dungeons done nets you 80% of your current level exp bar)
you can also quest of course.
alternatively, you can stand in one area doing dynamic events that chains alot like FATE-like system.

You clearly played it wrong. All you do is quest!!!

[Delsus]

I think the main thing people want is options. We shouldn't be locked down into being forced to questing like GW2 and newer MMOs do, nor forced to grind like they days of old.

Also, hi noc. I miss you.

The problem with that is balancing, quest mob's exp would have to be nerfed, or the questing would be far better with mob exp and quest rewards, if the quests didn't reward exp then you are just grinding.

Here's an example of what I mean, kill a mob for 200 exp, then another and another. There's 600 exp.

Now go to a kill 3 slugs quest for example, you kill the three slugs for 200 exp, then turn the quest in for 500 exp, that's 1100 exp, almost double for what could be a similar amount of time.

[Radacci]

The problem with that is balancing, quest mob's exp would have to be nerfed, or the questing would be far better with mob exp and quest rewards, if the quests didn't reward exp then you are just grinding.

Here's an example of what I mean, kill a mob for 200 exp, then another and another. There's 600 exp.

Now go to a kill 3 slugs quest for example, you kill the three slugs for 200 exp, then turn the quest in for 500 exp, that's 1100 exp, almost double for what could be a similar amount of time.

except the time it takes to turn in quests lowers the xp rate, while you could grind more mobs and lv faster than questing. questing is generally useless early on, because XP reward is shitty compared to the XP mobs give.

[Arcell]

I think the main thing people want is options. We shouldn't be locked down into being forced to questing like GW2 and newer MMOs do, nor forced to grind like they days of old.

Also, hi noc. I miss you.

And people will have options. As Yukikaze pointed out above, there are more ways to level than just questing. Side-quests won't, and certainly can't, be the only way to level. What if you finish all the quests and still have classes to level? Need other ways to level, which we will have.

[ChiefCurrahee]

When FFXIV was first announced they said there wasn't going to be "levels"

I thought maybe character progression would come from actually experiencing the game. Like for instance. You take on a quest or duty from a certain NPC or clear a dungeon and you are rewarded will a new skill or ability.

Or by completing content you are given points to spend on a skill tree.

Stats remain nearly the same from start to finish so it puts a new player and a long time player nearly the same stat wise. Only thing separating them is skill which is aquired from playing the game.

I suppose a new player could come in and be "power leveled" by established players walking them through the content to get skills and abilities. But thats bound to happen anyways.

I just think expanding the game in a side-grade fashion is easier in the long term, than constantly trying to balance upgrades.

[KiriA500]

I like how having a solo option means nobody will ever group up ever.

[Yukiko]

Best summary about all this anti questing thing:

I like how having a solo option means nobody will ever group up ever.

I assume none of those who are against have been invited into alpha yet. I say lets wait till you could test it an then lets meet again!


Something good to mention also for FFXIV:ARR

You don't have to quest solo. That's like saying the leves where solo only, when you could still do them as a party and get good EXP. Just because you did them solo didn't mean they were forced solo.

Who tells you, that you have to be solo to finish a quest? Its neither leves from 1.0 nor quests from 1.0, its something totally new! From that short video, do you expect it was a single leve accomplished? Do you even now how that quest continues? I like it how the NPC talk with you in that short video presentation, because it seems there is something special if you progress. Maybe you have to gain their trust before they entrust you with dangerous missions or secret informations! Remember in Alpha we just see the introduction because max level is 20.


Nowadays players are not good in remembering the past, so it is good to quote PSxpert2011 again:

All I have to say is Final Fantasy VI! Quest were actually Q-U-E-S-T. Also in FFxi, some QUEST were long, like the "Map- for-Crawlers Nest-side Quest".

... You set out on an adventure to accomplish something while taking on challenges along the way. Not really detouring from your missions or over all main adventure(you can accomplish quest when you have the chance, at any time).



People never use their favorite Final Fantasy as reference to this idea. I'm for one,will, as FF1 is the core example but FF6 beefed it up! OMG, the opera had to be the sweetest if not the longest side-quest of the game. It was the most memorable adventure within an adventure and I would be surprised anyone forgetting about it. Though you had to progress through the scene to meet the newest of the adventurers of the group so essentially is was part of the scenario.

Still, there were parts of a story that needed to be done to progress.



Does anyone remember as side quest in Final Fantasy 7 that was memorable, which had nothing to do with the main story but it was fun? How about that tower climb where you fought multiple enemies? Been to a town like Wu Tai lately? Again, I'm stating progression here and not quest grinding.



Please, if I wanted to grind, I'll find an excuse to farm mats and kill the same beast, monster or-what-have-you over and over again....

I know we all want content and it seems like the creative juices @ Square Enix is running dry.

After all, their latest and best work are of FFXIII and XIII-2(also upcoming "Lightning Returns) series. New generation of RPG ladies and gentlemen.

It is a great example to see that Final Fantasy had always been ONE big Quest where you rescue strangers, the princes, the world or something else... While progressing and coming around some little towns or because the path is blocked you had to help townspeople to continue in your mission - you always done Quests and that is a natural way of gaming in every RPG, if you dont like it, then play a shooter or something else!

I have faith in Yoshi-P and his Team, FFXIV:ARR will not become like any other MMORPG around out there!

Edit: Everyone needs sometimes some distraction from the normal doing and if you like to grind then sometimes you need a break with questing, or if you like questing you need sometimes a break and just beat some mobs ...