Job Individuality/Pride/Dedication

[Altena]

I only read the first page so I apologise if I repeat what has already been said.

Sorry, but I disagree. I like the flexibility of being able to switch classes on the fly, not have to spend 30 mins changing jobs / gearing up, and finally not having one specific "main job" that I want to play. I have a relic DRG and MNK. I am asked to play a DD when the situation calls for it, but also enjoy playing the other roles from time to time. I enjoy playing most content on multiple roles, and that not only expands the skill of a player, but also helps content become less stale and monotonous.

The only issue I can see at the moment, and possibly the issue that the OP is experiencing comes down to a lack of jobs and "party slots" in the current content. However this will only come in time as more jobs will be released, and larger scale content is being designed.

You are comparing a young game with 7 jobs, to an old game with 20 jobs. The reason there was more "flexibility" with the job you can do content with is because there was a wide array of jobs that were "similar enough" to each other. Want nuke stuff? You have BLM SCH and RDM (to an extent). Want to DD? There are a huge list of DD jobs (not 2-3 like in current XIV). My point is you are comparing a young game, with limited jobs to a game that has a wide selection of jobs with similarities.

The final point I will make is each group (in the current content) is limited to 8 players. XI had 18-32 for most content (depending). There is a lot more room for error / flexibility / personwithonlyDRGlevelled etc. How you utilize those 8 slots depends on the content, but this usually requires certain roles to be filled. You can't have 8 DRG mains run through Aurum Vale with no healer. Although an amusing sight, game mechanics don't really allow for it - and that's not something I personally would want changed by any means.

[Shurrikhan]

If you want to be stuck in a specific role, go play wow. I like switching jobs on the fly thank you very much.

If anything, WoW often does multi-role-usage better than FFXIV jobs, though that's probably just because its server framework makes "utility" roles much more viable with the prospect of kiting. As much as WoW does have some kingly elitists promoting the necessity of the tank/dps/heals trinity, anything less than boss fights can be no-tanked, no-healed, with enough skill. A rogue, likely the sheerest of dps classes, can potentially tank, in dps gear no less; he just doesn't do it by being a damage sponge. Instead, he's a 'nothing gets past me' tank. Right now, Monk is about the only job that gives off that versatile feeling. (Warrior, Paladin, and White Mage can certainly hybridize their roles about as well, but lack that mobile, fluid feeling.)

Stuck in a single class, sure. Stuck in a single role... no more than any FFXIV 'class', and less than most FFXIV 'jobs'.

Edit: "Used to do" multi-role-usage better than...

[Punainen]

You = Someone who needs to brag to feel good about themselves.

Restricting our ability to play whatever jobs we feel like; I vote NO. If you make people unable to switch, that's immensely lame. If you make people have to go to their 'mog house' to switch like in FFXI, that wont solve anything, and just make changing inconvenient.

[Lilith]

I only read OP's post.

I feel what you're saying. I like the armory system. A couple of things that would (partially) solve this problem:
- Make it harder / more time consuming to level a class/job.
- Make every class/job have a more in-depth gameplay that requires practice
- Make every class/job equally useful.
- Make artifact armor harder to get.

[Crevox]

I only read OP's post.

I feel what you're saying. I like the armory system. A couple of things that would (partially) solve this problem:
- Make it harder / more time consuming to level a class/job.
- Make every class/job have a more in-depth gameplay that requires practice
- Make every class/job equally useful.
- Make artifact armor harder to get.

Pretty much, and make it so you can't get armor/weapons for a class you're not playing.

Restricting our ability to play whatever jobs we feel like; I vote NO.

I never said that. I just want to restrict the ability to switch on-the-fly, perhaps by requiring you to go to a specific location to change classes. Yes, it will change things, because people are unwilling to accept party deviations due to how easy it is to change classes. It's a core game issue that has many negative effects on the community and the health of the game (the former is just one example).

You = someone who didn't read the whole thread.

If you want to be stuck in a specific role, go play wow. I like switching jobs on the fly thank you very much.

WoW is not like that at all. In fact, in WoW, it's even easier to play "multiple roles" due to the ability to swap your talents any time anywhere. Also, again, I never said we should remove the ability to change jobs/classes, just a restriction; however, that is only a small facet of the information this thread concerns.

Some people like playing a lot of classes; some people don't. I personally want to focus on one, I should not be shunned or penalized for that difference of playstyle (which may or may not be the same as the global playerbase's playstyle).

Every single content at 1.0 was doable with any job setup, you see the issue here is most players are LAZY, refuckinemphasize on lazy, if you want to do strat your way, then go make your own strat, go setup the party and proof to people it works and people will starts using it.

BUT no, people would rather on freakin whine on forum instead of refining their own strat, they would rather people carry their ass. So, they keep using the strategy that apparently they hates. Well, guess what? freaking suck it up if you are lazy.

This is MMO, there is never true balance, some job will shines at certain instances, some at others. Get this in your head deeply, this is the price you have to pay for uniqueness. What devs can do is make them all viable in the fights and that is what they already did.

Ifrit? magic and melee burnable
Moogle? magic and melee burnable
Garuda? you need both magic and melee to win
25m Speedrun instaces? you can win with any combination of battle classes


This issue isn't going away in a game where holy trinities exist, so suck it up.

The sad thing about this post is it has very little to do with my OP. It's like you copy pasted this from another subject because you liked the post; it's irrelevant. Are you just saying it's the communities fault with that wall of text or what? Because, I've already covered that argument.

What's funnier is this has absolutely nothing to do with the holy trinity. I have no idea why you even brought that up.

[Totorixiii]

Might as well bring back ffxi skill up requirement for every single skills such as weapons, enhancing magic, enfeebling magic, evasions, parrying, etc, etc to make leveling take more time???

Once level cap is raised to level 75 in the future, leveling from level 1 jobs will take much longer unless you play FFXIV religiously and gets to level super quick or lazily get PL all the way.

Correct me if i'm wrong but 2.0 ARR will have a substantial increase in experience points requirement to level up to next level compared to 1.0. Which means it will take much longer to get to level 50 from scratch level 1 job.

I guess for those who feel like its been too easy to get to 50 and has no more jobs at 50, well guess what, too late now, you will have to wait for new jobs and level cap increased.

And for those like me who only have 2 jobs at level 50, is going to have to level other jobs while taking much longer at 2.0 ARR.

I have a feeling that come 2.0 ARR, it will take much longer level up.

Maybe this will fulfill you partially when it comes to feeling more pride in your job?

[Crevox]

I have a feeling that come 2.0 ARR, it will take much longer level up.

That would be appreciated, although at the moment, Yoshi seems to favor the current speed of things.

[Soukyuu]

I've not met too many of these people, but as observed below your post, some people do get a little too set in their ways and won't look at other ways of doing things. Abolishing the Armory system will not change this. In fact it may make it worse, because people will have their class or job attached to their character. And people will only play the characters on the most popular class/job, leading to a shortage in the jobs that aren't "popular".

I don't really want to abolish the armory system, my first post saying it's basically "useless" is purely from the individuality standpoint. There is no individuality currently, because everyone playing a MNK has the same stats (equipment not counted), since different builds are not viable atm. This is what the armory was for me: experiment with different builds, mix and match classes. This was gone with fixing stat allocation and introducing jobs.

The old armory wasn't perfect either, of course. If you happened to like 2 classes which didn't share required attributes, you had to make a hybrid stat build and even though you could switch classes instantly, your stats stayed the same.

What they have to do, imho, is leave the stat allocation to us and balance the classes so that multiple builds are possible. Maybe this is what is going to happen once we get more than one job per class.

There are big differences in the approach to the game, IMO.

Most of the people in our Linkshell (JP) have everything at 50, but we each have 2 or 3 jobs that we like to play and therefore are better at it through experience and better gear. And we all know each others preferred jobs.

Depending on who is in the party, we usually shuffle our jobs around to find a mix that should generally work for the fight, and then go in. It's often not the standard mix, but it often works as long as people understand the fight itself.

People usually get to play a job they like, there's no need to go back and shout in Ul'dah, and leaving someone out because they don't fit a specific role is unheard of.

The ability to change jobs as necessary allows us to have a lot more fun.

That's pretty much the mindset I have myself. I only play classes I like to play, since it's a game, not a job (else I'd get paid for it, not pay for it). Many people don't seem to understand that making someone play a class they don't like means they will underperform, because that class is usually ungeared or the player has no idea how to play the class efficiently.

[darkm0d]

I've always wanted more job uniqueness. I am completely against "locking" your job, that's ridiculous, job flexibility is what makes XI / XIV fantastic (and other FF titles).

I made the point a while back about how lack luster job's seem to be, and I really hope they address that in ARR.

Ok, I just tried to find my post from like, months ago and gave up, basically I compared WHM from XI to XIV. If you ever main'd WHM on both, you get it. XI had something like, 103 spells, XIV has like, 26 or something. When ti came to class specific, I think it was around 68 or so, compared to like, 12 in ARR.

[HamHam]

Because switching jobs on the fly isn't something Final Fantasy is known for.

The game has been built around the core mechanic of switching your role on the spot. It's one of the few things from the original game that worked very well. Allows for much flexibility of dungeons. Cutter's Cry having you go Black Mage > Dragoon > Black Mage > Monk is an example of one of these strats. This post just seems like someone who's upset that they aren't a special snowflake due to this system.

Also this is the exact same as one of your earlier posts. At least try to make an effort when starting a new thread.

This guy sounds like a LS leader I know of.

I have blm and whm to 50 and with what I consider the best gear the game can offer at this present time. Triple and double melted gear. - Half way into relic quest - I currently have war and pld at 50 also and other jobs around 30ish, but hey, this was not enough when I applied to his LS. He told me "Sorry, but you don't have MNK all the way to 50, so we can't take you.” So, attitude like this only discourage people from enjoying the game.