Job Individuality/Pride/Dedication

[Arcell]

At the moment, it pretty much was. You could get darklight/some alternatives like militia, but depending on your class, most of the time it was the best or VERY CLOSE to the best. I understand 2.0 will be different and I'm hoping it will be to that extent.

Lol, dude you have no idea what you're talking about. A select few pieces of AF are good, the rest of it is pretty much garbage. Melds and drops (militia/darklight) outclass most pieces. With the exception of WHM, no one should be wearing full AF. This may change in 2.0 but AF was nowhere near the best. It was the bare minimum.

Like I've been saying, and you haven't addressed, if you truly want to be dedicated to your class/job then you'll be way better than any schmuck of the street who leveled it for fun. If you're truly dedicated you'll have better armor, better weapons and far better knowledge. Take two BLMs, one in full AF and one with double/triple melds and a relic. Who would you say just going by gear is more dedicated? Not always "better" but they at least took the time to gear it up.

[Davorok]

I think that this "elitism" in 1.xx was mostly due to these 3 reasons:

1) A limited player base

2) The limited player base having most if not all jobs maxed at 50.

3) The limited player base having completed the content runs (AF pieces, Job Skills, Primal Weapons, etc.)
(plus)
3a) The limited player base just doing Speed Runs.

I got "replaced" in many groups because I did not already have the AF pieces even though the dungeon we were gonna do was where you got the AF from because they just wanted to do speed runs.

I know many people have similar examples but these situations will be greatly reduced with a Larger & Newer Player Base.

[Aerenvel]

Class switching being so easy is a problem, but your point is true as well.



I don't care about how I look. ;p Cool new armor is cool, but it's not the issue here.



At the moment, it pretty much was. You could get darklight/some alternatives like militia, but depending on your class, most of the time it was the best or VERY CLOSE to the best. I understand 2.0 will be different and I'm hoping it will be to that extent.



When I needed to do content, I ran with randoms. I had no friends that played the game, and the friends that I made in game already completed everything that I needed to do (sometimes they would help, but most of the time they were busy with their own thing, which I understand).



I am excited, but I am also hoping that my main post is taken as feedback by SE for future design. This discussion has also been interesting.



Exactly, that's the problem.

Well you forgot 4. which is pretty much the main point you compare apples to limes, the problem with the system you say for you is, "It is to easy to switch jobs Looking from a negative stand point that looks bad but it allows others to fill roles that you may be lacking and or trying new strats on new content on the fly, without running b to their house very encumbersome.
3 AF gear is obviously not end all be all gear, take a pld for example you want a 6k hp pld with materia gear or and pld with af gear and not even a materia slot. Another obvious diff in dedication.
4 back to number 4 like i said before I played 11 when it first came out and let me tell you if you started in abby you do not understand the difference how you couldnt even lvl without a party. PLD dont even mean anything now where as in the begining they were gods auto tells on login.
All the things you complain about are due to you having an overabundance of time and developers not putting enough content at your whim. but there has to be a foundation then improved upon they are trying to do both.
With Level Sync they can do away with PL if they really wanted too. so for every complaint there are variables upon variables so i would advise suggestions that actually have a basis constructive critisim vs just out right complaining

[Crevox]

Lol, dude you have no idea what you're talking about. A select few pieces of AF are good, the rest of it is pretty much garbage. Melds and drops (militia/darklight) outclass most pieces. With the exception of WHM, no one should be wearing full AF. This may change in 2.0 but AF was nowhere near the best. It was the bare minimum.

I played a White Mage. That should answer this.

Like I've been saying, and you haven't addressed, if you truly want to be dedicated to your class/job then you'll be way better than any schmuck of the street who leveled it for fun. If you're truly dedicated you'll have better armor, better weapons and far better knowledge. Take two BLMs, one in full AF and one with double/triple melds and a relic. Who would you say just going by gear is more dedicated? Not always "better" but they at least took the time to gear it up.

This is true, but still doesn't take much effort. A relic is important, yeah, but double/triple melds just takes some gil; not time and effort. Yes, I understand it still shows dedication, and that's true, but still not enough. In my opinion, there needs to be more things you can do to invest time in the class to show you care about it.

4. AS time goes by and more and more content is released that focus will be magnifed.

This is true, but it just depends on how they do gear advancement. Is it just a linear increase? Can you "skip ahead" to the better gear, or do you need the previous to complete the new content? Also, even if you're playing a warrior in a 2.0 dungeon, how easy is it gonna be for you to grab gear for your alternate jobs? Most of the time, you don't even have to play that job and you end up gearing it just because "hey look I got an garuda bow, now my archer is pro." That's not dedication to archer at all, you just happened to grab a bow playing a different class. If you were forced to play archer in order to get archer equipment, and some archer guy had TONS of great archer gear... now that's dedication.

[Soukyuu]

I know many people have similar examples but these situations will be greatly reduced with a Larger & Newer Player Base.

I don't think so, to be honest. Most likely, new players will be taught by the "old elite" what the "right way" to do content is.

It was mentioned multiple times that in many cases you get refused because it's not "optimal" (time wise) to let you play your class. The devs said speedruns won't be the way to get loot, so maybe this will improve the situation somehow.

Also, the new battle system is supposed to rewards skillful play. This could end up in a "suboptimal" job dealing more damage as the "optimal" one simply because the player is more proficient with the "suboptimal" one.

[Crevox]

Also, the new battle system is supposed to rewards skillful play. This could end up in a "suboptimal" job dealing more damage as the "optimal" one simply because the player is more proficient with the "suboptimal" one.

I hope so, but if that's the case players need to learn to lighten up on the class restrictions when filling their parties.

[Ruisu]

I'm still on the fence on the issue at hand, but I'd like to make one thing clear. It is not the dev team's fault that content is prohibitively restrictive, or that players expect their party members to be able to switch to any of 5 classes on the fly. It is, however, their responsibility.

Making a game is hard work; really, really hard work. A lot of things can fall through the cracks and be forgotten or lack polish. I am often the first to give developers a long leash for these types of things. But we cannot forget that this is their game. If there is a problem, something that is causing many players to feel antagonized, that is their responsibility, and they should be held accountable for it.

This thread is wanting to abolish the system, rather than make fixes to the system. They want to restrict what is supposed to be a game with freedom to something where you're limited to a few jobs or when you can change to said job.

[Crevox]

This thread is wanting to abolish the system,

Who said that? This thread states that the system is a problem. Fixes can be made, and changes can be made. I don't really have any suggestions at the moment as to what changes or fixes would resolve the issues that exist, but there are definitely issues.

Speculating what COULD be done is a good topic of discussion.

[HiirNoivl]

Specialization happens no matter what the armory system.

Ask the people in the Linkshell "who The Tank is?" and they'll point to a half dozen people if they're lucky. "Who's the WHM?" Maybe 3 or 4.

While it's possible to completely master every job/class (and by "class" I mean THM) no one really does it. The armory system allows you to try out every class/job so that you can choose which one you really want to play. And that's what it's good for.

[Ruisu]

Who said that? This thread states that the system is a problem. Fixes can be made, and changes can be made. I don't really have any suggestions at the moment as to what changes or fixes would resolve the issues that exist, but there are definitely issues.

Speculating what COULD be done is a good topic of discussion.

Your complaint is that you do not like that someone can switch to being a 50 Dragoon by switching their weapon. How is that not wanting to abolish the system?