Job Individuality/Pride/Dedication

[Syrokko]

I wonder what percentage of the playerbase would complain if they were to introduce job-locking upon entry into an instance...
Just a funny thought.

The game would be so much more interesting if the players didn't have the freedom to change into whatever job they wanted to change to at almost any given time.

[Deakka]

You also need to remember the individual skill caps on jobs/classes. BLM has the most relatively simple rotation, in addition to being ranged and out of PBAoE. Monks as a contrast, have a much higher skill cap. I'll echo the sentiment that people will go with blm stacked groups only because... it's just easier for a bad player to do well on BLM than for an average player to do well on MNK.

Ideally with 2.0, they pick the learning curve up on BLM, taper it down on melee jobs, and give each job the tools that they're lacking in 1.0. No cooldown weaponskills means that MNK's (and BRD's, who at least had 3 AoE ws) will be able to compete in an AoE spamming environment along with DRG and BLM.

[Alerith]

My fastest Ifrit kill has been 1 PLD, 5 LNC, 1 BLM and a WHM.

You can talk about how the system doesn't work, but it does. For the longest time, people though "BLM or Bust." But then people started experimenting, and experimentation has led to alternate strategies.

The system isn't flawed. The thinking of the community is.

[Crevox]

My fastest Ifrit kill has been 1 PLD, 5 LNC, 1 BLM and a WHM.

You can talk about how the system doesn't work, but it does. For the longest time, people though "BLM or Bust." But then people started experimenting, and experimentation has led to alternate strategies.

The system isn't flawed. The thinking of the community is.

This isn't experimentation, this is class stacking once the player-base realized which class did the highest DPS.

[Alerith]

This isn't experimentation, this is class stacking once the player-base realized which class did the highest DPS.

I was using it as an example as to how people DO try different things. And you can do Ifrit with any mix of jobs, so long as you have *GASP* one tank and one healer!

Can you imagine?

[Crevox]

I was using it as an example as to how people DO try different things. And you can do Ifrit with any mix of jobs, so long as you have *GASP* one tank and one healer!

Can you imagine?

It's a really poor example, and extremely obvious. Why even mention it? If they didn't try it once they figured out lancers were the best, you'd be assuming the player base is stupid.

And this is exactly my point; people are only willing to try the best compositions. Everyone thought BLM was the best, so they did that; now they discovered LNC was the best, so they switched to that. It's not an issue in localized scenarios, but it's an issue when random parties deny you an invite because they're all going for that composition (because it's optimal/best).

[Aerenvel]

Lol....
When they allow add ons you will learn that it really does not come down to the class but how the player utilized the potential of it.
Gear will obviously help but diff fights require diff dmg
When you got a dps meter you might have 5drgs but if 3 are putting out 1k dps and the 2 are putting out 500dps a sec theres prob something wrong with the rotation or having to conform to fight mechs so dps lost moving vs range dps of tht of a blm that is also putting out 1k dps. Just because you see big numbers pop up dont mean they are doing the most dmg.
Big problem is people dont realize you cant change people the best you can do is inspire others to change themselves.
and how the community will mentor have patience for people is something i am starting to question.
People tend to tune out if you start yelling and degrading them.

[Cailae]

I wonder what percentage of the playerbase would complain if they were to introduce job-locking upon entry into an instance...
Just a funny thought.

The game would be so much more interesting if the players didn't have the freedom to change into whatever job they wanted to change to at almost any given time.

Player reaction would most likely to be complain, and then those that need it would find the new strategy that fits their needs. They would find the new optimal job setup and fight patterns and then shout for those. It wouldn't change availability for players without those jobs, at all. It would in fact more likely make it rougher for people joining through shouts as a guaranteed win in say, a TA 17 minute run would require much better gear than you can currently get away with in an optimal job changing setup. (the rest of this post is a more general reply, mostly aimed at the OP, this top part is the only direct reply to you)

We can't speak for ARR because we don't know what the requirements will be. We know that a lot is changing. Will the TA requirements for relics be easier? Will more jobs be viable? We don't know. But I can speak for what the game was up to the end.

when it comes to shout groups, people do not want to experiment. They want to go in, get their win, get what they came for, and leave. a PUG shout is not the time to be learning to testing a new strategy. This is even more the case when doing TA runs for relics. TA runs are pretty intense things. small mistakes can cost the entire run, in many cases. A group better geared/more practiced can get some time leeway. But it is a bit selfish of someone to expect a group to carry you when they work that hard because you don't want to change jobs.

This is not to say that there is not a place for testing new runs, or going with a different setup. But that is where your linkshell and friends come in. If you want to get people together to do a slower run/not 5 chests/not TA for relic run, you should! I am entirely sure that all dungeons are doable without optimal setups, and you can finish them this way. But, if you want to do them this way, you need to take the initiative. I see a lot of "I was kicked from a group..." well if you were kicked from a group that means that your goals and theirs didn't line up. The lesson here is not "Change the game to suit me" the lesson here is "Find people with my goals/desires" to play with.

Showing off your Dragoon with it's gear and then having someone immediately change to the same gear, what is the problem? Are you upset someone else that has other jobs put in the same effort for their dragoon, while also juggling other things? Should they not take pride in their stuff the same as you. If your Dragoons are identical, the situation goes one of two ways. Either your gear is easy to obtain, in which case you have a misplaced sense of pride. Or, You both worked hard on your Dragoon, and both should show pride. Dedication in one thing does not me dedication from other things.

The problem here seems to stem more from people that want to do content that is out of their reach currently. They want one job to be able to do all content. And I can understand this, entirely. But, that is a design decision. When they made the TA requirements on dungeons for Relics, players adapted and figured out how to do it. and to do it has high requirements of the players. It is not the community's fault, they adapted to the design. It is also not another player's responsibility to cater to your play style, which is what many players in here imply. "It can be done this way, if people would try!" and you may be right. but when I log in and start shouting to form a group and I have limited play time, I am not looking to experiment. I want my win before I have to go. Form your own party to try different combinations! Maybe you'll find a better way! And then next time I make a party I'll try the new better way, and you'll be an optimal addition.

In the weeks leading up to the final save, there was a mad rush to do Nael Van Darnus before it went away forever. There was an optimal setup, that you would often see shout groups looking for. However, in my linkshell, we did the fight dozens of times with sub-optimal setups. We took Dragoons and Warriors and extra Paladins and every job under the sun, geared well or in full AF with no melds. We got the wins, sometimes after wipes to account for the odd combinations. But it was very time consuming, sometimes hours for a win or 2. But that was on our time. Not anyone elses. I would also point out here that without dedicated members with lots of geared jobs changing around, it never would have happened. Flexibility is not a sin.

In the end you want to do content and you want your job to mean something. Both of those things are (were) possible. However it also seems you want to take away from others that are just as dedicated but also have other jobs they do. If you want the game to change to allow more flexibility in what jobs can get content done, I am right there behind you. I would rather not have to switch jobs 3 times to do a TA run in AV(WHM to BLM to MNK). But you have to expect from others that if an "optimal" way exists, they will want to use it. Even if they lock out job changing inside of an instance (or even outside of town) People with multiple jobs will still have an advantage here. Because as optimal ways are found, they will be able to go to more things. Even if we took out optimal, and went purely with the trinity (and make no mistake this is a trinity game) someone with all jobs leveled and geared can take up any spot, and thus in any group not full, they will get in, possibly over you.

If you want to make the game more accessible to more jobs, awesome! If you want to hold other players back that choose to be more flexible? Never going to happen. Not in a game with the job system.

[Totorixiii]

Everybody supports the on the fly job switch. Well maybe the minority who doesn't support it simply because it's their personal preference to display their pride and dedication and that they are unhappy by being ask to change to a job they don't really like and it disrupt their enjoyment of the game.

I don't know how many percentage wise as whole FFXIV community but my guts tells me it's the minority.

Everyone on this thread is correct be it the majority or minority. We just gotta learn to embrace the system and come 2.0 ARR we'll have to learn again to embrace the system while continue to give our feedback on this forum to improve the overall game play

[Reika]

Everybody supports the on the fly job switch. Well maybe the minority who doesn't support it simply because it's their personal preference to display their pride and dedication and that they are unhappy by being ask to change to a job they don't really like and it disrupt their enjoyment of the game.

I don't know how many percentage wise as whole FFXIV community but my guts tells me it's the minority.

Everyone on this thread is correct be it the majority or minority. We just gotta learn to embrace the system and come 2.0 ARR we'll have to learn again to embrace the system while continue to give our feedback on this forum to improve the overall game play

People really only hit on changing classes inside of a dungeon or instance that should change, like they do with hamlet defense. No one whines that they cant change inside hamlet, and dungeons are being re-made so there will probably not even be a reason to switch inside. I think everyone likes being able to change class everywhere else too. Yoshida said they are also looking at restricting job changes inside of dungeons, so hes thinking the same thing.