Who was really behind the Dalamud project? (Theory thread)

[Boxworm]

Hey forum. This is my theory I'm looking to get some input on. Tell me if you think it makes sense, if it's the most ridiculous thing you've ever heard, or TL;DR, I don't mind. I'm just having some fun with this while I wait for ARR!

So in the trailer, we saw that the Twelve's seal failed. But how could this be? They are supposed to be Gods! If all twelve of them include their powers, then surely they could defeat Bahamut, even if he does possess both Ifrit and Garuda's strength as well. But what if not all of the Twelve actually granted their power to the seal? Just because they're Gods doesn't necessarily mean all twelve of them have pure intentions. I'll get back to this in a moment.

Many have noticed that Louisoux, an Archon, seems to represent Thaliak the Scholar. Louisoux, as well as the other Archons, also seems to know a lot about the past Umbral Eras. Is this simply because they studied them, or is it possible that they were there to actually witness and influence them? Considering the Sixth Umbral Era was said to take place 1,500 years before the game's time, that would be no small feat. However, if they are in fact Gods, then living for such a length of time would be plausible.

In the quest 'Of Archons and Muses', Tyago Moui says this:

'Caught wind of all this Archon talk yet? Some folk make them for the very incarnations of the Twelve, come to Eorzea. Old prophecies and wives' tales say they descend from their heavenly seat whenever disaster threatens Eorzea, see.
Needless to say, many believe the Archons to have otherworldly powers - both of mind and body.'

So, though there is nothing conclusive here, we at least know that there are rumours about the Archons being incarnations of the Twelve. It is difficult to make many connections between the Archons and the Gods -- for example, Thancred is a Bard who uses knives. The closest I could link him to was Oschon, who is depicted as a carefree ranger wielding a bow. This, of course, is pretty far off from Thancred's character, however for now let us assume that these depictions are in some way incorrect, or that the Archons are attempting to hide the obvious connections.

To me, Rhalgr is the most interesting of the Twelve because of his title and symbol. He is known as the 'Breaker of Worlds' and God of Destruction. His symbol is the streaking meteor. Reminding you of Dalamud at all? At first I wondered if perhaps Darnus was Rhalgr's incarnation. He certainly wanted to cause destruction and break worlds, and was the one to order the meteor project. He is not seen without his armor on, so it is possible he also has the Archon tattoo.

However, again from the quest 'Of Archons and Muses', Tyago Moui tells us this:

'They say Ahldbhar was the mightiest of the twelve Archons. Rhalgr the Destroyer himself, taken form in Roegadyn flesh - a bloody mountain of a man, and a fearsome warrior'

Though I suppose it's possible that Darnus was a Roegadyn under that armor, and changed his name to avoid the Rhalgr connection, I think it's a lot more likely that he was actually serving Ahldbhar. Maybe Darnus didn't come up with the Dalamud project, and was just helping Ahldbhar to make it happen.

But why would one of the Twelve want to cause such destruction and death? In the game we are lead to believe that they all protect us. But, once again, we learn yet more interesting information from Tyago Moui:

'Ahldbhar fought relentlessly against a clan of wicked sorcerers that sought only to wreak havoc on the world through their dark powers. But then, something happened… Something that threw Ahldbhar into deep despair. And in the end, he turned and took up with the enemy, though none can say as to why.
What came of him after his betrayal? Well, I confess I haven't heard the end of the tale myself.'

So, what might this mean? It's possible that the 'wicked sorcerers seeking to wreak havoc' may have been those of Garlemald. Rhalgr was the Guardian of Ala Mhigo, so it makes sense that he could have been fighting relentlessly to defend them. Perhaps when Ala Mhigo was defeated, this is what threw him into despair. Or, perhaps he had already taken up with the enemy, and encouraged them to attack Ala Mhigo. It's not clear what could have happened or why, but I think this quest gives us a lot of interesting information, and some points to ponder.

And, let us not forget this line from the Seventh Verse of The Divine Chronicles: 'Divine order roils, fallen corpses writhe.' Divine order roils? Could this imply that somehow, the order between the Twelve was disrupted?

Perhaps this is why the seal could have failed -- it is possible that without all twelve, the spell could not be completed or strong enough to defeat Bahamut. What do you folks think? Could Rhalgr be the real foe?

[Alerith]

I don't mean to throw a wrench in there, but Rhalgr's sign was present during the sealing spell. In fact, each of the giant blue spikes that attempted to hold Bahamut had their respective symbols on the top of them, and if I can pause it right again, you can see a Meteor, Rhalgr's symbol, at the top of one of the spikes.

His power was indeed present, and I think Bahamut was just too powerful.

[Boxworm]

You are correct Alerith, you can clearly see his symbol if you pause just before the seal breaks. I guess I just don't like the concept that Bahamut could be stronger than the Twelve, so I wonder if perhaps simply his symbol being shown doesn't necessarily mean he was lending his power to it. I mean, it all seems like a strange coincidence -- his meteor symbol, titles, and the information given in the Of Archons and Muses quest.

Thanks for your input!

[Alerith]

You are correct Alerith, you can clearly see his symbol if you pause just before the seal breaks. I guess I just don't like the concept that Bahamut could be stronger than the Twelve, so I wonder if perhaps simply his symbol being shown doesn't necessarily mean he was lending his power to it. I mean, it all seems like a strange coincidence -- his meteor symbol, titles, and the information given in the Of Archons and Muses quest.

Thanks for your input!

I certainly understand where you are coming from, but let's just wait to see what place Bahamut actually holds in the XIV universe.

There are numerous things that could have happened, from absorbing enough Aether to at least break free to being a God-like being himself.

[Zenaku]

Bahamut been inside dalamud for how many years? i don't he most more powerful then he was when he was first seals. Dalamud is made of energy even darnus use this energy in the final fight and then his body went to dalamud.

I say that the Twelve are just that as powerful at that time when bahamut got free or bahamut is way more powerful now then he was.

[Zenaku]

You are correct Alerith, you can clearly see his symbol if you pause just before the seal breaks. I guess I just don't like the concept that Bahamut could be stronger than the Twelve, so I wonder if perhaps simply his symbol being shown doesn't necessarily mean he was lending his power to it. I mean, it all seems like a strange coincidence -- his meteor symbol, titles, and the information given in the Of Archons and Muses quest.

Thanks for your input!

The summon a god to the real world like ifrit or even the twelve it take energy from the world. Also the Twelve could be gods but they could always be something that would be stronger bahamut was piss being seal up that long and all that energy he got because of darnus even his body went to dalamud so it save to say the twelve is just not strong enough to seal bahamut back up at this time.

[kimoi]

I think people are making too much of the Twelve's failure and that this means Bahamut is stronger than the gods. In the end, it wasn't the Twelve, it was a mortal (I guess depending on your view of Archobs, this is debatable) who attempted to use the power of the Twelve, not the gods themselves doing it. Even Louisoix knew there was a chance it might fail, and that's why he had the last resort of making everyone disappear.

[Alerith]

I think people are making too much of the Twelve's failure and that this means Bahamut is stronger than the gods. In the end, it wasn't the Twelve, it was a mortal (I guess depending on your view of Archobs, this is debatable) who attempted to use the power of the Twelve, not the gods themselves doing it. Even Louisoix knew there was a chance it might fail, and that's why he had the last resort of making everyone disappear.

I'm actually gonna pull an example from Yugioh of all things...

In the Dawn of the Duel story arc, the ultimate darkness named Zorc is basically tearing shit up. So, Shimon summons Exodia, a deity so strong, it had to be sealed away, blah blah exposition. Anyways, Exodia was equal in power to Zorc, but because it drew it's power from a mortal, Exodia's power eventually waned to the point of being destroyed. Similar situation here as Kimoi said.

My own personal theory is that the Tweleve were never summoned and couldn't use their full power. If you watch the sealing spell, the spikes are holding Bahamut in place, and the symbols of the Twelve are rising from the ground, in what I believe is a symbol of them awakening or being summoned.

Bahamut broke free of his binds before the summoning could be completed. So it's not that the power of the Twelve was less than Bahamut's, but more the fact that they didn't even get a chance to use their power.

[Arcell]

You are correct Alerith, you can clearly see his symbol if you pause just before the seal breaks. I guess I just don't like the concept that Bahamut could be stronger than the Twelve, so I wonder if perhaps simply his symbol being shown doesn't necessarily mean he was lending his power to it. I mean, it all seems like a strange coincidence -- his meteor symbol, titles, and the information given in the Of Archons and Muses quest.

Thanks for your input!

We also don't know the circumstances behind the original sealing of Bahamut. The Allagans may have worn him down first before attempting the seal. This time we simply tried to seal him right off the bat. Most stories involving sealing immense power away in general would point to this being the wrong way to go about it.

Bahamut is likely far more powerful than the summoning of the Twelve at his peak. However we're also not aware that the gods themselves were actually present. They were likely just being drawn upon, which means they are not out in full force. Were they to actually directly intervene perhaps they could have won over Bahamut.

Too many things we don't know to say for 100% certain why it didn't work.

[elets]

Dont forget about that key thing that fell to the ground maybe its an artifact that weakens bahamut, or the actual lock sealing up the power. :/ just a thought