Will Relics create the same problems that they did in FFXI?

[Queezy]

You don't see a problem with I got this weapon it might of taken me 2 months to get and some work but now I am set for the rest of this MMOs lifespan?

To me in FFXI it was very boring how they never came out with better weapons to get after relics until abyssea.

U coulda got a Mythic? or another relic. For one this so called comparing 14's relics to 11's relics is just dumb. You could not get every relic in a month even if u had the best of the best LS possible and exploited them to the fullest( at 75 cap). I knew of plenty of people who went from 0 "relics" to 4-5 in a matter of weeks in 14.

11 and 14 have two very different content levels and gear itemization. 11 gear grind was way harder then anything that has been and prolly will be implemented into 14. The mmo genre doesnt has been dumbed down way to much for people to accept a design like 11's. We got ppl who complain about having to do a week long quest to get a relic,now compare that to the endless dynamis runs u had to do or better yet to the mythic quest line since that was more quest based, people would have a fit.

[Zumi]

Really I helped tons of people get their relics and I got rewards. Gotta say not needing to pay for Dynamis and gettng my AF (And some currency once we got so much we started to let it free-fall) So I gotta say there was little reason to be "Manipulated" into being part of a dynamis shell that sponsored runs.

In its prime for I would say 1 dynamis run would yield 12m worth of currency. The run only cost 1m, you can promise people AF2 and they can be happy with that but a lot of the AF2 wasn't that great so in essence if someone sponsored a run they made out like a bandit, in terms of gil made, you may or may not of got your AF2.

[Zumi]

U coulda got a Mythic? or another relic. For one this so called comparing 14's relics to 11's relics is just dumb. You could not get every relic in a month even if u had the best of the best LS possible and exploited them to the fullest( at 75 cap). I knew of plenty of people who went from 0 "relics" to 4-5 in a matter of weeks in 14.

11 and 14 have two very different content levels and gear itemization. 11 gear grind was way harder then anything that has been and prolly will be implemented into 14. The mmo genre doesnt has been dumbed down way to much for people to accept a design like 11's. We got ppl who complain about having to do a week long quest to get a relic,now compare that to the endless dynamis runs u had to do or better yet to the mythic quest line since that was more quest based, people would have a fit.

I thought getting a relic in FFXI was much more doable. You can work on it any time you wanted by farming gil. The thing is I knew people who played FFXI not so much for FFXIV. I did get relic in FFXI pre nerf I found it a lot easier to get one in FFXI then FFXIV. Due to the fact of not knowing anyone who really wanted to do stuff in FFXIV.

[Pofo]

Setting all the FFXI Relics vs XIV relics bs aside, yes relics will be upgradable in the future level caps to come. That being said, I could be mistaken but didn't Yoshi P mention that he intended on releasing "Legendary Weapons" that would dethrone relic weapons?

[MicahZerrshia]

U coulda got a Mythic

But you actually have to (/gasp) work (/shock) for those (/feint), cant buy/farm gil and get fast mythics.

I for one always was meh on xi relics, started working on the mandau and just ended up selling all the currency I had stashed away for it, then it happened again with excalibur. My goal always was at least one mythic but organizing those events and keeping everyone interested for that long a time was nearly impossible. The dyna ls I had ran smooth for years and we could alway pick up non-ls members to fill any gaps. 6+ years of xi and I still dont even have capt rank >< just because of the lack of interest and the work you need to actually put into it. Then having to do them all again for the mythic quest, def isnt/wasnt going to happen

Now with gil being meaningless making getting an empy and even relics so incredibly easy ppl just look at you confused when you say you want to get a mythic (although I still want one)

Need to really get in on the ground floor with xiv and dedicate myself to getting stuff done when its shiney and new and ppl are doing it ALOT.

[Reika]

I've said this in many past posts so I won't go on too long. These relics were released too early in a bid to keep us busy when SE realized they didn't have enough content to keep people playing and paying until 1.0 closed. It basically took all available content and mashed it together in a very inorganic way in order to prolong the lifespan of the game. Most who were super dedicated would be at least 3/7 by the early-mid August while and at least 6/7 by the middle of September.

So SE is left with a issue on their hands. If they launch 2.0 with superior drops from say the Crystal tower or even from regular end-game dungeons. People here will scream bloody murder much like people did when Burning Crusade was launched in WoW and all their precious epics were done in by Greens.

SE has a few options here.

1. Keep updating these relics ad nauseum. This effectively prolongs a played out quest in order to keep them relevant. Other content may be neglected in order to just keep your relic as up to date as possible.

2. Don't give 2 shits about the 1.0 player-base whining and complaining much like Blizzard gave 2 shits when they launched BC. They got over it quickly enough when they started getting the new epics anyway.

3. Subtly change the name of the weapons to Artifact weapons for 2.0. This covers their ass and allows them to launch future relics/mythics/whatever without freaking out the oldies. They could streamline the quest-line for the AF weapons as well in preparation for a very difficult quest-line for the new relics/mythics.

But in all honesty we did this quest to keep us busy until the servers closed down. It is foolish to think that we now have access to the most powerful weapons in the game for the rest of time. New challenges will present themselves and we should be happy to see our old weapons go to the wayside as the game progresses. Kicking and screaming because something may be more powerful is simply not realistic nor conducive to innovative game design.

Agree with the too earliness of the relics of their current strength, and that they should go with #3. Simultaniously kill the stupid Relic Reborn quest for non-repatitive non-copy/pasted quests for each weapon. And, I think they should have waited til ARR for realic weapons where the quest(s) could have been planned out a lot better.

#2: people have already stated their dislike for games expanding by way of lvl cap increase will will inevetibally make their old gear obsolete by the first item 1 or 2 levels above their last epic item. I dont see how some people could expect an MMO to just STOP producing and expanding so there would eventually be nothing to work for and then the game would just become stagnant and die early. Unneccisarry tears will dry up over time anyways. People will play the game for the new gear and most likely have fun doing it, and thats what an MMO and any other video game is about.

[Guevara]

SE made relics available very early on in FFXI's lifecycle in 2003. They were the top weapons until 2010 when abyssea came out and gave us Empyrean weapons some of which were better then relics.

Relics created an artificial ceiling on weapons in FFXI in that no weapon released in that 10 year time span could be better then a relic or have higher damage on it.

Now we have FFXIV they released relics early on as well. Are we going to see a repeat of what happened in FFXI where every new weapon that comes out has to be worse then relics? Or will we actually see them come out with new weapons that are better then relics?

At Lv50 relics will be the best weapons.

After Lv-cap raise, we will have higher level weapons better then current relics, but will also have a new hard quest to upgrade our relics and make them the best weapons out there.

Basically same as it is now.

[Fadigre]

Guess I'm a little late to the party!

I've noticed a common theme is this thread and that's the comparison between XI's relic and XIV's relic. We don't really know where the game is expected to turn next so what I'm about to say may turn out to be stupidly stoopid - XIV is not XI
Who said relic have to be the strongest!


Before I jump on the bandwagon I'm just going to share some information regarding my XI career so that if I'm wrong, forum-goers are welcome to post in several different threads how wrong I am.
I didn't do any end-game in XI. Being only in my mid-teens On Cait Sith I wasn't really comfortable with the european end-game shell as it was full of (what felt like) middle-aged men. The most end-game I ever did was a few Dynamis runs until 8am in the morning, finishing CoP and floor 100 of Nyzul.


/bandwagon

Speedruns doesn't take skill beyond knowing what the fuck you're doing and how to play your job because the relic specific speedruns relied on everyone being on point which consists of:

-Knowing how to listen.
-Knowing how to gear your job. (Dedication.)
-Knowing how to play your job probably (Dedication to learn.)
-Knowing the battles. (Dedication to learn a run properly.)

Is this not what XI was, too? What did XI have out of what has just been said that XIV doesn't have?
I feel like I must be missing something.

From experience (whatever that means to the people of the world) the only time when a fight can go pear-shaped is when the strategy requires a party-member to exercise decission making. If players are not required to make a decission then the content can be ran through mindlessly until Dalamud's dawn.


Is XI that hard?

So what exactly was it that made XI tough and XIV so pathetically easy? There's only one answer I can think of and that's because XI had fewer relics on show; was this related to genuine difficulty? Correct me if I'm wrong (no, seriously, correct me) but didn't XI's relic require you to just farm a shit-load of beastmen currency? Is that not worse than what we currently have in XIV?

This requires
-No skill on the player's half (see Elexia's quote)
-What was widely accepted to be gigantum amounts of gil
-Collossal amount of grinding time

If a similar system was implemented in XIV which required you to grind content over and over (which is the exact thing players have complained about) the playerbase might have been pushed too far. What if... somebody died from the outrage.

Like, in real life.

Can you imagine the news?!


Wrapping up

Maybe I've spent too long on my soapbox here contributing discussion regarding something I've no idea about but didn't XI rely on the RNG just as much as XIV. Granted XI doesn't have materia melding but isn't that just a short-term RNG that costs money rather than time, replacing dungeon grinding?

To get your first sweet piece of gear and then your second piece from end-game linkshell in XI is going to take just as long to get that drop from Cutter's Cry you've wanted, surely.


Focus XIV

I'm surprised this thread became so large!
When relics were announced wasn't it also announced that they were to be upgradeable? We don't really know what level we're going to end up at in 3 years time but imagine down the line we're level 100 after several 5 level increases and for each 5 level increase we have to upgrade our relic further. This quest has potential to end up huge. It also had potential to be a pain in the backside when a new job comes out that you've recently got to cap (let's say uhm... Blue mage) and you'd like to get the relic for it (it's got like 3,000 STR. Seriously, get it). Now you have to start way back at the level 50 weapon and slowly upgrade it to your level 100. May the 12 have mercy.

[Crevox]

he doesnt have one so his argument of not in this game is void

Cute, but I don't want a relic in 1.0 so I didn't even go for it. The only relic weapon I have interest in is Summoner.

[Nero]

I'm not going to all that Stuff posted allready.. but 1 thing..

FFXIV Relics are more AF Weapons than everything else. ( Read the PDF and you will see that "Legendary Weapons" are around the Corner i.e. Excalibur ).