SE Please implement a Chonoscroll/PLEX system in FFXIV: ARR

[axemtitanium]

No p2w doesnt mean just that. If you can play the game at 1/10000 the rate you can access all the options but you will not win compared to someone else.

To "win" you need to pay.

When you introduce p2w or your own RMT system you will devalue the currency and thus inflate prices. Anyone who doesnt pay to win will therefore play the game at a slower rate.

A PLEX system specifically combats inflation and is self-regulating such that if people who don't take part in it will be unaffected by it. Please read my original post for why that is.

[A_Hortensia]

A PLEX system specifically combats inflation and is self-regulating such that if people who don't take part in it will be unaffected by it. Please read my original post for why that is.

A lot of these concerned people aren't so much concerned about inflation or how it'll affect the in-game market.

They are mostly concerned with someone paying real money to get ahead in the game.

Everyone on both sides agrees that RMT cheaters/botters/spammers and economy manipulation are bad.

[Shougun]

A PLEX system specifically combats inflation and is self-regulating such that if people who don't take part in it will be unaffected by it. Please read my original post for why that is.

No it doesnt combat inflation.

It only creates a limit in the direction you can RMT. You can use real money to buy in game currency. The limit is you cant use in game currency to buy real money - you can only use it to buy time.

Its an obstfucation of buying in game currency from an RMT but it is still buying in game currency.

And it is untrue that people not taking part in it will not be affected.

You are introducing a new method of passing around currency - that flow will go AROUND those players who dont take part. Effectively minimizing their ratios compared to those who are using real money.

End result meaning - p2w has been legalized in game.

[Abriael]

No p2w doesnt mean just that. If you can play the game at 1/10000 the rate you can access all the options but you will not win compared to someone else.

To "win" you need to pay.

And in fact in this system you don't NEED To pay at all. People that don't pay can still get exactly the same items, exactly the same statistics as everyone else.

To have a pay to win system you have to NEED to pay in order to win. Ergo, it only applies where people that pay have access to statistical bonuses and items that othr players can't access.

When you introduce p2w, your own RMT system, you will devalue the currency and thus inflate prices. Anyone who doesnt pay to win will therefore play the game at a slower rate.

False.

You don't devalue the currency at all. The amount of currency on the market remains exactly the same. While some people's buying power will increase, some other's will decrease, the end result is the same.

This system decreases inflation as it cuts the earnings of RMT, with it their budget, and with their budget their workforce. Less workforce means that they can inject less currency in the market, causing less inflation.

On top of that, it adds a further gil sink because transactions are taxed.

It's funny how people continue to sustain the theory that it will devalue the currency when it flies in the face of both economical theory and both of the real examples we already have in place.

Of course you can swear to god that the sky is yellow with green polka dots. But that doesn't make it true, no matter how many times you repeat it.

[Shougun]

And in fact in this system you don't NEED To pay at all. People that don't pay can still get exactly the same items, exactly the same statistics as everyone else.

To have a pay to win system you have to NEED to pay in order to win. Ergo, it only applies where people that pay have access to statistical bonuses and items that othr players can't access.

Those who dont pay are actually making things worse. They are supporting p2w by farming and then selling their farm to someone who used real money. Basically you become an RMT shop and non paying players become your Chinese workshop farmers.

And you really are ignoring or dont get the pay to win meaning. If you can pay to play better, it is a pay to win system. If you can use real money to get ahead, it is a pay to win system. This idea IS a pay to win system.

False.

You don't devalue the currency at all. The amount of currency on the market remains exactly the same. While some people's buying power will increase, some other's will decrease, the end result is the same.

It's funny how people continue to sustain the theory that it will devalue the currency when it flies in the face of both economical theory and both of the real examples we already have.

You increase reasons to farm - increases currency, devalues currency, inflation on prices.
True.

Also in your own words you have labeled this system pay to win. "While some people's buying power will increase, some other's will decrease". This is not acceptable.

[Jynx]

Pay to win indicates a situation in which whoever pays can access gameplay options that people that don't pay don't have access to.

Can't say I know where you heard that. From what I understand Pay to win meerly means any game that encourages you to pump money into it for overwhelming advantages that others need to work for (Or as you stated can never aquire without paying). While Exclusive content falls under the catagory it's far from the only use of Pay to win.

In this scenario players who are willing to pay more, have a advantage that other players do not despite the fact they all pay the same subscription fee.

It's one of many ways to monitize your game, but it's not really in the players interest do have such a system (IMHO of course). Of course people could work around it depending on the game system where rare and hard to obtain items that can't be obtained with any ammount of gil (Aside from hiring merc groups) gain large ammount of value it happens in many MMOs where the in-game currency is over-inflated, or easilly obtained without putting the normal ammount of work into it.

Ultima Online was like this, there was no PLEX system but Gold had reached such a rediculous abundance that it in itself became nearly worthless and the only way to really trade was with other items. It's not a good thing when your players start to consider bartering as the best way to get a fair deal...

[strallaalaa]

if you play 20hours a year you shouldn't be at par with others who play 5hrs a day every day. pay2win is there with this type of system. this is a cash shop in disguise, you pay SE you get gil in return by trading it. we pay a monthly for a reason ...to enjoy a mmo that is not a P2win. if i want this i can go play a F2P mmo. people don't get that time invested in a mmo to have things others can't get is a huge point of playing. the only good part of this idea is playing for free and i still would rather pay the 15bucks..hell 30bucks a month to keep the game company from being a inside, ok rmt.

tldr simple: no time to play mmo, don't play mmo. like i pay 15bucks for the same amount of content as a offliner game. or play 2hrs a day even to have some douchebag pay for the same position.

[viion]

I really like this idea, it works very well in the games it is in.

I think SE will really have to consider something like this because I don't think they will survive being P2P. There is just too many good freeness out there and much to come in the years that XIV will have to compete with.

That said, being that 1.0 was P2P i don't think SE is really bothered, I know they're a company that needs to make money but they barely shift on anything, XI is still same price, never shifted, even its addons are still same price XD I think XIV will stay monthly and it will likely be a huge disadvantage for the game, but not one SE sees as an issue.

[AttacKat]

I have been keeping out of the PLEX discussion because I felt there are enough people going back and forth on it already ... that said ...

Some additional issues that calls for further discussion:

1. Fear of Cash->Gil buying to move char ahead.
This is one issue SE need to address. With EVE online, your "skill" is limited by how many skill points your avatar has learned, and EVE uses real time as their limiting factor for this. No one player will ever learn faster then any other player.

As we can see with real time as your avatar's development speed, in EVE, in advanced levels it can take over 6 months for your avatar to be ready for the next ship. So even with ALL the cash, me buying that ship which requires 6 months of skill training time will not put me much ahead of another player due to this limitation. However, in this game, your skill is limited by your experience pts which we can cap over a busy weekend.

Balanced market:
EVE has a very extensive trading system. So much so, you can play EVE full time and do nothing but and just trade from a market with thousands of orders. I founded my 2nd account with 100m isk and was at 1.7B after one month, which in turn funded my 1st account's equipment purchases from there on. I can buy/sell anything, perform order updates every 5 seconds, and analysis market history with years of history based on my filter. SE's market system is at best a simple listing of the lowest 20 sell orders, and the last 20 solds. Current market system must include a lot more buy/sell/analysis functions in order to provide the tools necessary to create the condition for a balanced market.

Fear of F2P:
As I always tried to explain to new EVE players, it is do-able, but not feasible if you are working. Someone mentioned about doing it via mining. Using my own "friendlist" as the source, the best isk/hr (isk = eve currency) from mining I have heard in EVE was 20m/hr. The best I have done isk/hr playing was 12m/hr. Now, when you consider that the PLEX was around 300m, that will required at least 15-25 hrs of game play. For those non-income earning players, this F2P is still a very do-able option, but for those that do work, paying the $15/mo becomes the much preferred method. ;p

Hope this helps ...

jc

[Heavell]

this is quite a nice idea but... i strongly disagree if SE going implement it on ARR.

IMO this system quiet good only for several MMORPGs but just NOT for Final Fantasy online...
i like the way XI's works, especially when working on some content with LS's base DKP system. Players log, players do their best for the LS, players have the rights to loot, players spend their time and making a nice relation between members. SE does the right job, sell in-game quality to players, i think this is MMORPG i've been looking for.... but with this system..someday this game is going to meh. well i'm leaving if this ever happened.

but it's unavoidable that "gil buyers" exist, well most of them lazy to do things and want easiest way to achieve something, rare to talk to newbie and arrogant in most case.

Well in my PoV, i always treat LS members as "family", im enjoying my time when talk with them including when solving drama or issues inside LS. personally, i don't have problem with gil buyers, but for me.... by doing that, it's like have no pride.

note : Whatever, people have different ways to enjoy this game i'm glad up until now SE didn't implement this system. Good luck with your thread.