Sum-nom-nom-eners~

[Crevox]

The only reason they did Yuna like that in Dissidia was memory liimitations, they specifically said they couldn't get the whole summon model out so they did that funky way.

And, we don't know how summoner will work in terms of pet mechanics. All we know is Summoner has 4, Arcanist has Carbuncle, and the Summoner ones are different elements that serve different roles.

[Ryuko]

There have always been so many different methods to dealing with a 'summoner' class across the Final Fantasies.

In some, you summoned that avatar/primal/aeon/whatever for just a few seconds, it did a powerful ability, and left. Carbuncle obviously won't work this way (because of the ability to let him tank, which was mentioned), but none of us are sure about the others. Would the elemental avatars work this way?

In FFXI, you summoned an avatar and spent mana to keep it out as well as mana to use its abilities. If you ran out, or you chose to dismiss it, it would leave. While it was out, it acted as its own entity. Although friendly PC's could not cast on your avatar, enemies could, and so your avatar was efficient at tanking or absorbing abilities (like 1k needles).

In FFX, a summoner became immobile while you, personally, controlled the aeon. Yuna would sit on the aeon or stand next to it... sometimes even run away if it was so large. While your aeon was out, it took all damage for you. None of your party was harmed, and neither was the summoner. What if this is brought into play somehow? (You summon an avatar and gain control of it, but also are forced to be near it, or stand on it.)

Going from the concept art alone, it seems as though the essence of the avatar is summoned specifically from a book. This might be misleading simply because all we have to work with is the concept art, but it is something to consider. The essence seems to be coming out of the book, and perhaps it is only but a fleeting moment that passes while that essence is summoned and maintained?

We really can't know for sure.

As an answer to people who replied to my previous posts: I definitely agree that some giant/gigas race would definitely worship Shiva. The reason I didn't consider them is because there's been no info released about those. I believe I saw the concept art of the sahagins long ago, but simply didn't remember them because they look very different from what I'm used to. To the person that said the beastmen I mentioned aren't aggressive: No, they are not, but at least some of them WILL be in 2.0. I was personally part of an event where goblins attacked the city. (Keep in mind, when they were spawned, they were still green, but we were urged by an NPC/GM to kill them. I'm pretty sure they were green then only to make sure they didn't maul low levels. After the final save, all bets are off.)

[Fantasia]

The only reason they did Yuna like that in Dissidia was memory liimitations, they specifically said they couldn't get the whole summon model out so they did that funky way.

I just used Yuna as an example, it doesn't really matter why they did it and how they did it, it just perfectly matches the image I had in my head about how summoner might work.

And, we don't know how summoner will work in terms of pet mechanics. All we know is Summoner has 4, Arcanist has Carbuncle, and the Summoner ones are different elements that serve different roles.

We know this too =b The whole point of this thread is to discuss ideas of what we think might happen and/or what we'd like to see. Nobody knows what's happening with it yet, it's just nice to see some ideas about how people have incorporated the few bits of information that we've been given.

There have always been so many different methods to dealing with a 'summoner' class across the Final Fantasies.

To be honest, as long as it's not identical to how XI worked I really wouldn't mind too much. But now you've put the image of X's aeon system into my head... that'd be an amazing method, albeit verrry difficult to get working. But yes, the concept art is pretty much the majority of my inspiration for the 'single attack' method, although that could just be the pet being mid-summoned.

[Jinrya-Geki]

Yet another who sees mage as a bad thing, which it is.

[MaethusXion]

What about the SIREN concept art?

[Tonkra]

What about the SIREN concept art?

well it maybe is going to be an other primal to fight against.. and maybe also to summon with a public company in pvp.

but i dont think for the summoner job. two are already confirmed as "pets" (or whatever they are going to be, a single hit spell or whatever)...


and these are Garuda and Ifrit.

[Undrentide]

Maybe Arcanist is going to be used as an proper enfeebling type class...this would give Carbuncle some use...the Arcanist cant do direct damage apart from dots and enfeeebles while Carby does the damage through direct attacks.

[Fantasia]

well based on the concept art i thought almost the same.. although i would be really disappointed then to be honest.. i wanted a PETCLASS... and not an other mage who casts spells..

i want to have PETS.. and not just an other form of attack spells, which would it be then..
if its going to be like that... i personally would stick to arcanist.

But THAT is not a summoner to me.. its a real DOWNCUT.. a pseudo summoner, wannabe. a fake summoner.


and dissidia come on.. its a beat and up game... not a roleplaying game... if they implement that shit into 14... good night. but i think this is gonna happen.
but its really not what summoners are used to be in the series. a summoner would be downgraded to a mage which spells would be visualized differently. i thought SE is going to implement a petclass.


i dont mind if its different but a one hit spell attack is just too poor to be true.. and i think its would be disappointing for all of us. maybe the summoner job would be more efficient to all those "skillOr playerbase".. but it would be really "lame"


well i think because its a beat and up thats why they made it with "single hit" attacks of course. But FFXIV is not a beat and up

I know Elexia already mentioned this, but in almost every FF game up to X (including Tactics and other spin-offs) SMNs WERE a single-move job. X and onwards were the only ones where the summoner actually used the summons in a different manner, and Yoshi said that he wanted to take things down a more traditional route. I believe one of the earlier player polls even mentioned introducing classes like Arithmetician which we haven't seen in a long, loooong time.

Maybe Arcanist is going to be used as an proper enfeebling type class...this would give Carbuncle some use...the Arcanist cant do direct damage apart from dots and enfeeebles while Carby does the damage through direct attacks.

I think the main difference between a summoner and an arcanist will be that, even though summoners could not call Carby, they'll have the Primal attacks to deal damage. So if all of Arcanists' own moves are all DoTs and Enfeebles then there's no real way to kill anything unless they added Carby to the fray, but switching to SMN would allow you access to those 4 Primal attacks which could (potentially) be devastating. The presence of these 'spells' would be why Carbuncle is no longer needed, if that's what they're planning to do.

[Ryuko]

I wouldn't mind if it was like XI in the aspect that you were able to keep your pet out. I would mind if, in a party setting, you were encouraged to literally just summon your avatar for an ability, release it, and rest until your timer was up again (throwing in supplemental abilities so you are not wasting time). Of course, you were expected to throw in heals/buffs here and there, but that's a discussion I don't want to spark at this time. I played summoner in XI for years, and this really was what you did in party play. Your rarely, if ever, left your avatar out attacking in a party unless there were special circumstances. Even when they implemented TP affecting the strength of an avatar's magical burst, it still wasn't something people actively used. What did make summoner more interesting was when they split the timers between attack abilities and buff abilities. This made it more interesting.

However, that was a game where you needed to kneel and become immobile if you wanted to restore mp. If you stood up again, it took a few precious seconds to get back on your feet before you could do anything. In this game, you can start casting again immediately, and if you simply stand still, your mana will start to regen. FFXI is but one example of how a 'pet class' was done in an MMO. Although Yoshi P has admitted that he wants to draw from the classical FF's, it might be worth taking a look at other MMO's and how those pet classes were done as an example for what it COULD be.

Many of us are looking at a summoner's abilities through the view of 1.0. "Oh, well each class has 5 abilities, so summoner probably will too." This will all change in 2.0, I'm sure, or as the level cap increases (which it WILL, but not anytime soon). Perhaps there will be more quests added for ALL classes with more abilities to choose from. What I think we should be looking at in our speculation is how the alpha/beta is played for the classes we can already look at. None of this information will be public knowledge until more players are invited, but it might give us a clue. How does timing change for these classes, and how are class-based abilities restricted?

[Majoga]

Even in Xi most SMNs summoned, used one Pact, then let it go. I would love to see them as a pet class with them out all the time, like the beasts themselves had to gain TP to actually do their moves.