CG Midlander

[Catapult]

Ahh i stand corrected, i never got to finish all of Gridania stuff so i had to take a lil liberty.

Though i still say that O-App and E-Sumi lead you along in the present knowingly.

And if nothing else we have a whole lot of plot coming up in the future.

It would be easier to say that the padjal begin to lead you along in order to make best use of your naïvity as the story progresses, even if they don't properly understand what it is you can do. As you spend more time in the past, you gradually go from being a nobody to someone who is a bit of a historical contradiction that O-App is then capable of picking up on.

"Sonething tells me you will not meet with much trouble finding [Fye]"

This of course assumes that the echo allows us to make small changes to history, predominantly to what people remember.

[Enkidoh]

Having read through this excellent thread I noticed there's however a contradiction to this lore that I'd really like to clarify (I'm really sorry to Ferne, as he's done an awesome job trying to sort out all the lore for us) - and that's the constant reference to the Echo being 'time travel' - it's not, at least, not in the literal sense.

In reality, to me it's more of a form of clairvoyance/telepathy, reading a person's memories and actually 'placing yourself' in them in a kind of dream state - Minfilia mentions this and explains how the Echo works when you first arrive at the Path of the Twelve:

"The Echo allows you to breach the wall of a person's soul, and hear the resonations of their past. You will be there in their memories, seeing things as they saw them. You may even interact with that lies therein. However, the past is like a stone tablet. You cannot uncarve what is already written."

So really, what we all experienced in the first part of the game is not the literal past, but a kind of dreamworld taken from ten year-old memories (when I read that line of Minfilia's memories of FFVIII came back to me - in fact, the very nature of the Echo itself was a lot like Ellone's power in FFVIII.).

The big question is, exactly whose memories did we access during the first part of the game? Especially the very start - if for instance in the Gridanian storyline Papalymo and Yda aren't actually there when you first arrive in the Black Shroud, then who was it then that the Echo accessed memories from? I really hope Ferne can shed some light on this as it's really been bugging me for a while now.

[Myranda]

Having read through this excellent thread I noticed there's however a contradiction to this lore that I'd really like to clarify (I'm really sorry to Ferne, as he's done an awesome job trying to sort out all the lore for us) - and that's the constant reference to the Echo being 'time travel' - it's not, at least, not in the literal sense.

In reality, to me it's more of a form of clairvoyance/telepathy, reading a person's memories and actually 'placing yourself' in them in a kind of dream state - Minfilia mentions this and explains how the Echo works when you first arrive at the Path of the Twelve:



So really, what we all experienced in the first part of the game is not the literal past, but a kind of dreamworld taken from ten year-old memories (when I read that line of Minfilia's memories of FFVIII came back to me - in fact, the very nature of the Echo itself was a lot like Ellone's power in FFVIII.).

The big question is, exactly whose memories did we access during the first part of the game? Especially the very start - if for instance in the Gridanian storyline Papalymo and Yda aren't actually there when you first arrive in the Black Shroud, then who was it then that the Echo accessed memories from? I really hope Ferne can shed some light on this as it's really been bugging me for a while now.

If I'm reading this right, I think I big distinction needs to be made between Ellone's FFVIII power and the Echo. Ellone seemed to send you into the body of someone in the past, and she had to know that person besides. With the Echo, you seem to show up as your own separate entity in the past (and this is the part I might need our resident lore-scholars for...) and I don't think you need to know the person you're jumping into the memories of. Before you learn how to control the Echo, it might be possible you can jump into the collective consciousness of many people floating about in the aether...?

[Catapult]

Ooh! Oooooh!

The memories of Hydaelyn?

Heed the crystal's call...

[Kirisu]

Armory System.

Not sure why it needs to be any more complicated than that - we've seen NPCs use the teleport/return function, no reason why they wouldn't be able to change classes as they please too (and occasionally show it in action in a trailer).

^This

Its simple, the first trailer was an echo of the past. Remember, he was viewing someone else's memory, and its worth noting that, that was not an ordinary sword on his back, it was a greatsword, thus by word of god, he was neither gladiator nor marauder in this video... In the ARR trailer, they've put him in a WAR AF to represent progress, he's an adventurer, a hero of eorzea and he needs to look the part!

[Hestern_Nestern]

I dare not stay in this thread for too long, for fear of being lost within it...but I come quickly now to say to Enki:

What you are referring to reminds me a lot of psychometry and retrocognition (which are sometimes said to be related). Or, I guess, retro-remote viewing? He he. Carry on. I just wanted to say that much.

/flee

(It should be noted that neither psychometry nor retrocognition involve being physically present for the event relived but rather involve a downloading of information previously calculated by other hands).

[Deli]

@Catapult

GamerEscape coverage of the media tour goes up today, so I'm now free to quote...



Yoshida explained the three story arcs that will make up the story for A Realm Reborn:

1. In this arc, the consciousness of the planet has formed into the Mother Crystal whom then speaks to the players. This is the storyline that will stretch throughout the entirety of the new FINAL FANTASY XIV.
2. Grand Companies vs the Garlean Empire. Yoshida noted that for this arc, an important keyword is “Warriors of Light”.
[/URL]

So... It's safe to discuss who are Warriors of ~~
"Don't you drag me!" /turn back and warn the men in black from NDA department.

Gosh these NDA men are so annoying...

/clear throat
Just ask for ppl's guesses...
So, who will be Warriors of Light? Are they save us from Bahamut and prison him at somewhere?
What's your guesses...?
Since midlanders got teleported before everyone got saved, so I think they are out of the possibility.
Is that white light shinning on Lou's face from "warriors of light"? Is that why he's smiling?

• can it be we players are one of the warrior of light but we lost memories or npc don't recognize us?
  • You know in MMORPG is an interesting situation that we somehow is the "only" savior but not alone! In the mission story line, the other players doesn't exist. Some of them will show up as your "friends" but they are replaceable. However, I doubt SE will give us such glory...
• more special R tattooed people came to save us?
  • like the kitty and that monk and that blm lala... can't remember names at all =.=
• newly made up secret society. or that blond hume lady lead us
  • since there is a keeper of the secret, like that white raven family, jump out of surprise; there got to be enforcer family or something like that jumps out to keep the order. like watch the witches...
    I believe this version more...
• Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn ARRRRRG got mad and whole robe exploded and became super galka and started to shoot laser gun; Kan-e-Senna got mad white robe exploded and became x-men Storm; Raubahn Aldynn's subligar shinning rainbow neon colors and became sheman!
  • I think someone disagreed with me before that these leaders are strong. but you know there is still a 0.05% chance... XD and it's kinda fun to see Grid leader jumps up to the air and whole white robe shattered and started to shoot lightning...

[Enkidoh]

I dare not stay in this thread for too long, for fear of being lost within it...but I come quickly now to say to Enki:

What you are referring to reminds me a lot of psychometry and retrocognition (which are sometimes said to be related). Or, I guess, retro-remote viewing? He he. Carry on. I just wanted to say that much.

/flee

(It should be noted that neither psychometry nor retrocognition involve being physically present for the event relived but rather involve a downloading of information previously calculated by other hands).

Well, your idea is actually very logical Heste - especially when you take into account how those with the Echo are actually perceived by others in the present day during an 'Echo episode' (for lack of a better word) - although not specifically shown it seems that an Echo user who is experiencing the Echo seems to be in a trance or dream state (in other words, time is continuing at it's normal pace in the present), when all of a sudden they 'snap out of it' when it ends.

The original 1.0 opening hinted at this: when Derplander suddenly snaps back to the 'present' after his Echo trip to the Battle of Silvertear Falls his elezen pal sarcastically quips: "Look who's returned from his reverie?" - after checking my old pocket dictionary 'reverie' is stated as being a 'daydream' or 'absent minded state', seeming to suggest that Derplander was physically still in the present, just completely unresponsive nor lucid while his mind jumped back 10 years into the past.

So yeah, psychometry or clairvoyance is a good enough 'real-world' label for the Echo as any (it should also be noted that the other side effect of the Echo - being able to understand any language in Hydaelyn) also has a real-world equivalent: xenoglossia, although it should be noted that the purported incidents of xenoglossia in the real world usually are far less extensive than what Echo users have (xenoglossia evidently only manifests as understanding of a single 'unknown' language, where as the Echo gives apparent mastery over all Hydaelyn languages, even those of the beast tribes).

But I think I've gone off on an Echo-trip of my own here so I'm going to stop now.

[NoloeTazier]

So... It's safe to discuss who are Warriors of ~~
"Don't you drag me!" /turn back and warn the men in black from NDA department.

Gosh these NDA men are so annoying...

/clear throat
Just ask for ppl's guesses...
So, who will be Warriors of Light? Are they save us from Bahamut and prison him at somewhere?
What's your guesses...?
Since midlanders got teleported before everyone got saved, so I think they are out of the possibility.
Is that white light shinning on Lou's face from "warriors of light"? Is that why he's smiling?

• can it be we players are one of the warrior of light but we lost memories or npc don't recognize us?
  • You know in MMORPG is an interesting situation that we somehow is the "only" savior but not alone! In the mission story line, the other players doesn't exist. Some of them will show up as your "friends" but they are replaceable. However, I doubt SE will give us such glory...
• more special R tattooed people came to save us?
  • like the kitty and that monk and that blm lala... can't remember names at all =.=
• newly made up secret society. or that blond hume lady lead us
  • since there is a keeper of the secret, like that white raven family, jump out of surprise; there got to be enforcer family or something like that jumps out to keep the order. like watch the witches...
    I believe this version more...
• Merlwyb Bloefhiswyn ARRRRRG got mad and whole robe exploded and became super galka and started to shoot laser gun; Kan-e-Senna got mad white robe exploded and became x-men Storm; Raubahn Aldynn's subligar shinning rainbow neon colors and became sheman!
  • I think someone disagreed with me before that these leaders are strong. but you know there is still a 0.05% chance... XD and it's kinda fun to see Grid leader jumps up to the air and whole white robe shattered and started to shoot lightning...

Clearly the Warriors of Light will be what we're referred to. Us/the Midlander and his party. The Circle of Knowing may know of Louisoix's Plan B if things went awry, but I doubt the Grand Company leaders were filled in. So as they looked on as Bahamut was preparing a blast to wipe Louisoix and ourselves (CG Midlander and party representing us) out, all they see is an explosion and nothing surviving in it's wake. I highly doubt Louisoix told the GC Leaders the his plan would be to warp us into a void-like place for 5 years. There could even be the possibility that of the Circle of Knowing, cept for Urianger who seemed to be Louisoix's right-hand Elezen, didn't even know of Plan B..considering they were off praying or activating the spell and were not there to witness what happened. We won't know until we're able to use our characters and see how the story applies to us and our return.

As for the other questions I'm not sure what you mean, R tattooed people came to save us?

As for the secret society, you ultimately have the Circle of Knowing and the Path of the Twelve. Then of course there's the Syndicate. Just a few examples of secret societies. As for the 'blonde hyur lady,' Minfilia will still be around and we don't know how the Echo will be effected in ARR. Ultimately we had the Echo to learn of things prior to the year 1572 Sixth Astral, whether we'll need this power or not in ARR I'm not sure we can say. Of course we would need it to speak to Moogles and Sylphs and Beastmen alike..so I'm sure we'll still have it. Being able to witness the happenings during our 5-year absent will be a major storyline that I'm sure we're all looking forward to.

[Anonymoose]

I'm still drowning in Lominsan lore over here, but should point out that the Syndicate is not a secret society. They're the ruling elite of Ul'dah in name, title, and public recognition. Their motivations and deals may at times be shady, but its membership is plain as day - the six wealthiest people in town.

In the Immortal Flames story arc, Raubahn (leader of the Flames) takes part in a high-stakes duel and the winnings end up pushing him over the cusp of being one of the six wealthiest men in the city. This deposes the least-wealthy of the Syndicate members and puts him in his place (this is possibly Rycharde, who says that Raubahn ruined him that day).

Now, usually, the Syndicate is at odds with the Sultana and her advisors - they have direct control of the economy and fear anything that could assert more sway over it than they could. However, the sultana is ecstatic that Raubahn is now on the board and they seem very close friends - he even refers to the fact that his ascension to the Syndicate was a promise he made to her, with her end of the bargain to come (though, perhaps it already has - this is a flashback after all, maybe her end of the bargain was that he would lead the company. He seems to value prestige and wealth little if it didn't come with victory).