SE stop doing the "norm"

[TomCarroll]

Slower leveling implies even pacing and content; A more natural and memorable sense of progression with numerous milestones that keeps players interested. End game does not have to, nor should be the point where the game begins.

I agree with this point. I'm not against reasonably steep curves in experience required to level, however, I just don't want to have to rely on other people every time I want to make progress. SWTOR had a very interesting concept in "Heroic" quests, which, (assuming that you were level-appropriate,) REQUIRED you to group with other people in the area. The problem with that idea was that 2-3 months after launch, many leveling zones had cleared out, so you really couldn't tackle them how they were meant to be tackled.

Don't worry Jocko, when people blow through all of ARR's content and begging SE to provide more content and they can't, they'll finally realize it's not about wanting "more grind" it's about pacing, something all new MMOs do horribly wrong in one way or another.

I also agree with this. No matter what, there will always be people who feel the need to rush to endgame. I can remember when WotG came out and one person on our server toook DNC from 1-75 in 3 days... I really have no idea how they're going to offer enough content to level all the current jobs, so maybe getting to cap won't be an issue.

[Dannythm]

I agree. And I have skimmed through the thread and seen more or less all the opinions, and I have to say that everyone is right, and I will try to point out all the things that are right in this thread:

• Square took a huge risk with 1.0 stepping so much from the standard, but they paid for it and it failed not because it had the wrong concepts, but because it was all horribly horribly executed and well... nothing worked as they intended, and if it worked as they intended even worse.
• The game was rushed and not really polished, and most of us were left wondering what where they thinking when they ended the beta and announced the game would ship in that state.
• After the fail Square has changed the direction of the game and trying to make it more appealing to, well, everyone. With this they are walking a dangerous road, because us, the ones that are currently playing the game will dislike it if doesn't offer something unique, as that was the main reason we came to play it at first, but if it's too different from what the rest of the market is offering it will seem like the same recycled recipe every other mmo is doing and nobody will get interested in the game. So Square needs to innovate, not taking huge risks but innovating and offering a different experience.
• Square SHOULD step up and make all content matter, make the game start at lvl 1, and pace the leveling accordingly. Some ideas like LvL sync would work wonders with this.
• Grinding and having long term goals in mmos are not synonyms, so Square should aim for that. Knowing it will take 10+ months to achieve something would make people stick with the game if the process of achieving it is enjoyable.
• The focus on the game should be character development, not leveling, not endgame, but a combination of those. Especially in a game where you can level everything with a single character. There should be plenty of content to complete at any level that can progress your character without mattering what level you are, and then some content focused on high level combat, gathering and crafting players.
• The focus on group/solo player should be as diverse as the content of the game, there are people who love playing single player games with a chat, some people don't even want to play it it's not with friends. I think the game already has a great base for that, so let's see how they expand on it, but then again, this is inherently tied with how is the content and leveling paced, and how is the character progression designed.
• And finally and more important, no matter what Square does, someone will be disappointed and get pissed at them.

At least this is what I got from reading the thread, and of course the info has gone through the filter of my own judgment so... is Yoshi heading the game and making it unique but appealing enough? I have that fear, but also there is a lot we don't know yet so... the only thing we can do is wait and speculate.

[Babydoll]

Yet people do that in XIV lol.

Fact lol. I spent more time standing around Uldah bored to tears then actually doing anything. Because without a clique (which I refuse to have) can't do much of anything!

[Soukyuu]

• And finally and more important, no matter what Square does, someone will be disappointed and get pissed at them.

And everyone is hoping it's not going to be them... ^^

[Gentaro]

Fact lol. I spent more time standing around Uldah bored to tears then actually doing anything. Because without a clique (which I refuse to have) can't do much of anything!

Why not, isn't that the essence of an MMO?

[Elexia]

Why not, isn't that the essence of an MMO?

Maybe for today's MMO gamers.

[Antipika]

Why not, isn't that the essence of an MMO?

It can be a MMO and still offer fun and interesting content that can be done solo/duo. Not everything interesting should be party+ only.

Obviously the solo content shouldn't yield items more powerful than what you can get in a raid. It's all about finding the right balance. Even in games that push the "massive" aspect way farther than XIV (not hard), you still have a lot of content for solo players on the side.

Also solo and massive can work well together with things such as zone event. A massive crowd can be formed with tons of single players.

[Arcell]

Unique doesn't always mean better. A lot of things from XIV's launch were unique and it was awful. By the same token unique doesn't mean bad either, but being unique for the sake of it won't get you anywhere.

The "norm" is generally so for a good reason. People keep using certain ideas within the same genre because they're good. Not to say every "standard" is the best for every game or not to innovate, but the "norm" isn't necessarily bad. There's always room for innovation and improvement but generally the standard is a good place to start.

A Realm Reborn is a new game essentially, time for people to re-evaluate if they want to play Final Fantasy XIV. Those who don't think they'll enjoy it, I'm glad you're coming to a rational decision and steering clear. If the game isn't what you want to play, the only logical decision is to not play it lol. Trying to turn a game into something it's not will never end well.

That joystiq comment doesn't make a good point, IMO. The lack of markers on a quest doesn't make it challenging, it just makes it "longer". Even then people make guides, most people use them and then it's the same. Whether it's in the game or not is fairly irrelevant, it all ends the same.

[Babydoll]

Why not, isn't that the essence of an MMO?

Well...hrm..I play MMO...(Massive Multiplayer Online) game to play with a wide diverse amount of people. If I wanted to play with a small close group I could always play FPS. I love meeting new people and making friends, the more the better!

Also to people wanting and condoning fast leveling - OMG LET ME RUSH TO 50 IN LESS THEN A WEEK and then when the time comes I have no idea how to play my job!! Which is why PUG groups DONT WORK IN FFXIV! No one can play for crap. (Well not everyone, some people can play just fine of course) WHICH is why when people shout they are forced to say "EXPERIENCED PLAYERS ONLY PLEASE"

[Jaimie]

FFXI, that should have been your core model for 2.0 not GW2, RIFT, WOW, what have ya.

Please read these comments

http://massively.joystiq.com/2012/10...ke-to-see-mor/

You can see, most people are tired of how MMOS are being made, and they want them back to how they were(aka FFXI)

"... What made MMOs fun back in the day (and kept me logging in) was the sheer challenge of the content. Quests are fine to me, but do we really need a HUGE question mark? Glowing trails and arrows pointing you EXACTLY where you need to go? All that does is focus the gamer to consume the content as soon as possible. And we all know how much fun that is. Questing alone doesn't make me want to logon everyday. Its the complete experience."

I'm also not saying be stuck in the past, but add new things, be creative try something new that another game hasen't but keep that whole MMO WORLD feel. To me that's adventure, companionship, not, "go here, go there, go here" That's not any types of fun, that's just a good time killer.

Quests in this game suck. Every time I get a quest, I have to check my journal over and over again. Maybe if I could put marks on my map like I did in 11, I could tolerate them. But, for now, I am sick and tired of having to check my journal over and over again. And, what's with the map button always moving? Put it at the top where the journal text won't move it.