SE stop doing the "norm"

[Andrien]

The style of gameplay being implemented, has nothing to do with the technology.
That's what we're concerned about. They had the oppertunity to make a solid game built on what XI provided, but they squandered it. They ripped that thing out before it was fully formed and in their folly, worked on creating something that does nothing to innovate or add anything. Not so much a big deal when your only competition was one or two games, but in an age with a well established monolith and hundreds of failed copy cats with minor tweaks and a fresh coat of paint, why on earth would this work?

Like I said, Square is banking on the references combined with the inoffensive nature of "Standard design" as a means of keeping this game alive.

Like him or not, Tanaka had vision. Tanaka had plans. And all of that was pulled out of the oven well before it was fully baked. So we ended up with a soggy cake with looser frosting. The kinda frosting you find on those waxy cookies in a grocery store bakery. The kind that tastes like it's been there for well over a month in spite of the many preservatives heated efforts to hide the lack of flavor and preparation.

First of all, they ripped out what was not working and what the majority didn't want, and removed features from 1.0 to be put back later in 2.0. Even before they removed features they asked us in player polls if we're okay with drastic changes.

The copy-pasta landscape is from the very beginning. 100% done and completed.. self explanatory. All this also contributed to bad embarrassing reviews for a final fantasy game.

Tanaka couldn't add any content because there was an overwhelming amount of problems. As a director and producer of a game, you are the boss of the development team, you have to decide whether or not the game is ready for release. He made some mistakes.

[Gramul]

First of all, they ripped out what was not working and what the majority didn't want, and removed features from 1.0 to be put back later in 2.0. Even before they removed features they asked us in player polls if we're okay with drastic changes.

The copy-pasta landscape is from the very beginning. 100% done and completed.. self explanatory. All this also contributed to bad embarrassing reviews for a final fantasy game.

Tanaka couldn't add any content because there was an overwhelming amount of problems. As a director and producer of a game, you are the boss of the development team, you have to decide whether or not the game is ready for release. He made some mistakes.

1. The game was not ready when it was released. We know this from reviews.
2. Square took every opportunity to take the polls wherever they wanted. Example: "Do you want to have some battles instanced to avoid stealing bosses?" Me: "Yes SquareEnix, maker of Final Fantasy Fourteen. I would like that." Square: "Well it looks like you guys want most of the game to be instanced" Me: "SquareEnix. This is not what I said yes to" Square: "Moving on, we have this thing over here"
3. When they said "Drastic changes" I thought they meant changes. Instead I get "Standard" thrown at me like it was candy instead of grenades.
4. The landscape is a result of not only the horrible Crystal tools engine that was forced on them, but the fact that the game was nowhere near completion, and they had to put together a large tile based environment on what little they could work with.
5. Tanaka couldn't add any content because he was taken off the project 3 months into its release.
6. He was not the one forcing the game out before it was ready. But I know he made mistakes. Especially with the bot and gilseller prevention nonsense surrounding the trade system.

This is part of why I'm mad. This is part of why I'm not confident in the games future. This is why my gorge rises every time I see someone talking smack about Tanaka and praising Yoshi like they where the devil and God.
All Yoshi has done so far is shave off the few things that made this game interesting in the first place and shove it into the line of regular MMOs and slap some FF references as a way to separate it. Though I am gland about the world redesign.

I don't want this game to fail. I have spent the last 2 years doing what I could to try and keep it from failure.

But I can't lie to myself and say that it's going to be a big success based on everything they've show me.

Do you really think the basic structure with Final Fantasy stickers plastered all over it is going to keep people in this game? Where games based on franchises with far more fans have failed to impress? Star Wars? Lord of the Rings? Not major successes. Certainly not enough to survive on a subscription based model for long.

I can only see this making a small and ultimately disappointing splash at this point. People will probably be all: "Oh yeah, it's a huge improvement. It's just kinda standard. We've seen all this before."

How will that hook anyone?

[Denmo]

I can agree with what you're saying, Gramul. It is worrisome at times.

But I also think that at this point it's far to risky for SE to try anything daring and new. They dug themselves into that hole when they forced the game's launch early (I think I know who to blame for that, and it certainly isn't Tanaka). The most we can hope for is a standardized MMO with FF chocobos plastered on top at this point. I'd rather have that than nothing at all.

Take Capcom for example. They had everything they needed to make another standard, fun, old-fashioned romp in Mega Man Legends 3. They didn't need to take risks. Just follow a set formula that Inafune laid out for them. Did they? Nope. Nope nope nope nope nope and honestly that pisses me off more than if they had at least given it a mediocre attempt. Capcom's now hurting because they've suddenly killed their iconic franchise. I'm never buying another Capcom game, which is a shame because they had good things going for them.

At least SE has the balls to keep truckin'. I can only hope they take the standard MMO experience and somehow make it better.


IN ANY CASE this topic is pointless till we get our hands on the actual game.

[Gramul]

To be entirely honest, I'd say it's a bigger risk to "play it """safe"""" due to the extremely high failure rate in doing so. (far as MMOs go)
But yeah, we'll see.

[Azurymber]

I actually liked 1.0. While it had some serious flaws, the actual gameplay and design was pretty awesome. Once Yoshi took over i felt like they took out the coolest parts (massive parties, animals that followed you, etc)

I think that the main thing ffxiv is lacking is adventure. I remember in ffxi, exploring a zone was dangerous. Finding a camp was -fun-. I was hoping xiv would be somthing like playing bst on xi (which was seriously the best gaming experience of my life)

On ffxi when you played old style bstmaster, you would find mobs to use as pets, and a camp to fight stuff. Sometimes they would be at opposite ends of the map. You'd pull or kite the pet mobs -all- the way to your camp and then try to switch them when health got low (they would start walking back... but slowly). Overall, leveling took strategy, knowledge of the mobs, and knowledge of the lands.
I'm not saying charming pets is the way to go. But when you get strategy, every fight is different.

Instead every fight became -hit hit hit ws hit hit hit ws heal hit hit hit- like every other boring mmo out there.

Even with repetitive ffxi parties, you got really fun stuff like trying to get a party to Yhotar jungle through yuhtunga's confusing tunnels and drops, long pulls to the entrance of garliage citadel. etc. If you linked stuff, things were actually dangerous. Getting to leveling spots took effort.

XI felt like an adventure at every point. Even beating the early CoP stuff to see the new areas was exciting. And when you got to the new areas the music, atmosphere, and story all combined to make it feel amazing. Each part of the zone was different.

Even with wings of the goddess, you got some really awesome exciting new zones to explore. Having to sneak past armies of aggro mobs, seeing cascading waterfalls, etc. It was all beautiful.

XI was a true adventure and experience. And this game has completely lost every aspect of that.

I really hope the re-capture it in 2.0. But from what they have shown, it doesn't look very promising. But we shall see

[Firon]

To be entirely honest, I'd say it's a bigger risk to "play it """safe"""" due to the extremely high failure rate in doing so. (far as MMOs go)
But yeah, we'll see.

This boggles me ppl keep saying mmo's playing it safe are failures but those mmo's still have more subs than xi, but you guys call that successful. I'm at a lost for words.

[Rokien]

I can agree with what you're saying, Gramul. It is worrisome at times.

But I also think that at this point it's far to risky for SE to try anything daring and new. They dug themselves into that hole when they forced the game's launch early (I think I know who to blame for that, and it certainly isn't Tanaka). The most we can hope for is a standardized MMO with FF chocobos plastered on top at this point. I'd rather have that than nothing at all.

Take Capcom for example. They had everything they needed to make another standard, fun, old-fashioned romp in Mega Man Legends 3. They didn't need to take risks. Just follow a set formula that Inafune laid out for them. Did they? Nope. Nope nope nope nope nope and honestly that pisses me off more than if they had at least given it a mediocre attempt. Capcom's now hurting because they've suddenly killed their iconic franchise. I'm never buying another Capcom game, which is a shame because they had good things going for them.

At least SE has the balls to keep truckin'. I can only hope they take the standard MMO experience and somehow make it better.


IN ANY CASE this topic is pointless till we get our hands on the actual game.

That's to bad, because Dragons dogma is one of my favorite games, like, ever.
Just because they did bad with one game, they have DmC, RE(RE6 was super epic, don't care what anyone says) All their fighting games.Capcom is doing well, and making good quality games.

But now and here is not the time for capcom. MMOs are.

[Ruisu]

That's to bad, because Dragons dogma is one of my favorite games, like, ever.
Just because they did bad with one game, they have DmC, RE(RE6 was super epic, don't care what anyone says) All their fighting games.Capcom is doing well, and making good quality games.

But now and here is not the time for capcom. MMOs are.

The best part is that I know you're being serious when you say this. This thread is complaining about why FFXIV isn't the most innovative shit ever, but here you are.

Praising RE6.
and Dragon's Dogma.
and Capcom in general.

I just can't stop laughing.

[Rokien]

The best part is that I know you're being serious when you say this. This thread is complaining about why FFXIV isn't the most innovative shit ever, but here you are.

Praising RE6.
and Dragon's Dogma.
and Capcom in general.

I just can't stop laughing.

I'm going way off topic here

What's wrong with RE6?
What's wrong with Dragons Dogman(seriously)

[Ingolf]

I'm going way off topic here

What's wrong with RE6?
What's wrong with Dragons Dogman(seriously)

Everything, literally.