Small Rant on Seal Rolls in Hamlet parties

[Wynn]

What I find wrong with this method of helping your buddies is they sneakily used wynn to do it. They should just wait til the rest of their buddies log on and help and not use people. Do a whole buddy party where all 8 people knowingly agrees that they will be getting seals for the buddy that needs. if you cant get 8 of your own friends that you party with all the time (static) in the party, then you should just follow normal loot rules and not try to sneak things in on people.

Just my thoughts really.

Thank you, Reika. And that is really my point in all this. If this had just been disclosed up front, I still wouldn't have been ok with it, but I would have bowed out so they could replace me with someone who was.

But, to be clear, this wasn't the whole rest of the party conspiring against me and the other guy, at least not to my knowledge. This was just two players trying to game the drops on their own. Unfortunately they were successful and I was blind to what was going on until it was too late. My fault for being naive, i guess.

But I know now not to group with either of these people or invite them to my groups anymore. I'll also be cautious about grouping with anyone from their shells from now on, which is a shame.

[Raikki]

Thank you, Reika. And that is really my point in all this. If this had just been disclosed up front, I still wouldn't have been ok with it, but I would have bowed out so they could replace me with someone who was.

But, to be clear, this wasn't the whole rest of the party conspiring against me and the other guy, at least not to my knowledge. This was just two players trying to game the drops on their own. Unfortunately they were successful and I was blind to what was going on until it was too late. My fault for being naive, i guess.

But I know now not to group with either of these people or invite them to my groups anymore. I'll also be cautious about grouping with anyone from their shells from now on, which is a shame.

I'm just shaking my head in disbelief at this point, but if that's what makes you happy you're more than welcome to play the game like that. I'm just trying to warn you that your idea of loot morality is out of the norm here and you're only going to make life harder for yourself if you let things like this impact you so much.

I'll leave you with an analogy:

8 people sit down at a table and are asked to select whether they'd like cake or pie. 4 people pick cake, and the other 4 people pick pie. After they're served, one person gives their slice of cake to their friend. Outraged, Wynn, who also selected cake, complains "that's not fair, he should have to cut his slice of cake into thirds and give us each an equal portion of it!"

[Gentaro]

There are 8 people working for the seals, if there is one person in there that doesn't need seals he still works as hard as the other 7 do - if he helps a friend out that friend gets a twice as big chance to obtain a seal, but they're putting in twice as much effort into it as the rest does for that chance.


What annoys me are these "provisioner claims first seal" groups with tards who trade in 20k items and think they're god lol

[Wynn]

I'm just shaking my head in disbelief at this point, but if that's what makes you happy you're more than welcome to play the game like that. I'm just trying to warn you that your idea of loot morality is out of the norm here and you're only going to make life harder for yourself if you let things like this impact you so much.

What I find hard to believe is that you would be ok with this if you were in my position and somebody did this to you.

I find it hard to believe that anyone would be ok with that or think it was commendable they did so unless they were on the benefiting end, which is also detestable in and of itself in my opinion.

I'm glad I'm not that kind of person. And if I am the minority as you say then I'm happy to be so. The majority of a group can feel strongly one way about something and still be wrong. History is littered with such things so that doesn't really bother me one way or the other.

However, I'll correct your analogy to make it more in line with what actually happened. 8 people sat down to bid on a cake and a pie. One person changed their mind and said they wanted the cake instead. They won the bid for the entire cake and then gave it to one of the three original people bidding on the cake. Three people actually wanted the cake, but one of them got two chances to acquire it and won as a result.

Interesting you chose cake in your analogy. Brings the phrase "let them eat cake" to mind. Strikingly appropriate.

[Meatdawg]

What I find hard to believe is that you would be ok with this if you were in my position and somebody did this to you.

He passed his loot (that he won) to a friend. He didn't kill your cat..... Your morality is laughable.

So lets blacklist him and never group with them again because you misunderstood his intentions.

It takes 8 people to run a hamlet. Not 7. Not 4. Those other 4 people that didn't roll on the seal... are they there for shits and giggles? What happens when someone really does ninja loot from you? If you are spamming refresh to debate this ridiculous topic to death what will happen when you really are wronged in game?

In poker when you have a bad beat you move on. You need a short memory. In FF when you have a bad beat (your perception) you run the forums and QQ about it and look for justification.

You claim in every other post you don't care yet quote and reply to every thread that says your point of view is flawed.

Sounds to me like your just butt hurt you have to run hamlet again.

[Wynn]

He passed his loot (that he won) to a friend. He didn't kill your cat..... Your morality is laughable.

So lets blacklist him and never group with them again because you misunderstood his intentions.

It takes 8 people to run a hamlet. Not 7. Not 4. Those other 4 people that didn't roll on the seal... are they there for shits and giggles? What happens when someone really does ninja loot from you? If you are spamming refresh to debate this ridoucls topic to death what will happen when you really are wronged in game?

In poker when you have a bad beat you move on. You need a short memory. In FF when you have a bad beat (your perception) you run the forums and QQ about it and look for justification.

You claim in every other post you don't care yet quote and reply to every thread that says your point of view is flawed.

Sounds to me like your just butt hurt you have to run hamlet again.

Why shouldn't I reply to posts directed at me? This is a discussion forum is it not?

You know you can talk about things, even debate them, and not be emotionally invested in them. Even in a forum.

Shocking concept, I know.

[Meatdawg]

Why shouldn't I reply to posts directed at me? This is a discussion forum is it not?

You know you can talk about things, even debate them, and not be emotionally invested in them. Even in a forum.

Shocking concept, I know.

What you just posted did none of that...

[Wynn]

What you just posted did none of that...

Ok, if you say so. Sounds like you are projecting to me.

[Raikki]

It's not "the entire cake", that's just it. The way your hamlet PUG works, you're being rewarded for your effort each run by receiving an agreed upon probability of winning a seal. Your reward isn't the seal itself, but the roll for it. By rolling on that seal in that last run, you received the reward you requested: a chance at the seal at a probability you agreed to.

[Wynn]

It's not "the entire cake", that's just it. The way your hamlet PUG works, you're being rewarded for your effort each run by receiving an agreed upon probability of winning a seal. Your reward isn't the seal itself, but the roll for it. By rolling on that seal in that last run, you received the reward you requested: a chance at the seal at a probability you agreed to.

I disagree, unless you can also cut that seal into 8 pieces.

It also was not a probability I agreed to. Nobody said "hey guys, I'm changing what I want to seal even though I don't need it so that if I win the seal I'm going to give it to this guy."

1/8 does not equal 1/4. And technically, since other people were not bidding on seals at all the actual fractions are 1/3 does not equal 1/2 of lots.