Small Rant on Seal Rolls in Hamlet parties

[Hanabira]

I can see if the guy asked to change his lot after it fell. if you agree to the lot change, you cant complain about it afterwards. if you WON the lot by 3 points, would we have a 15 page thread about it? if for example, you join a linkshell's group for hamlet, and everyone in the group is giving the seal to 1 person unless you win, would you leave the group because if it?

because since if everyone wanted it for themself, or everyone gave it to 1 person, they all did equal work and they can do whatever they want with it. since your odds are the same, the only reasoning is that you dont want someone completing the stage faster than you. personally if theres such a group where everyone already has their seals, it sounds like a sound group that gets stuff done.

[Wynn]

Guys I just want to reiterate because several people either are getting the wrong impression or didn't actually understand what I've been trying to say. So I'd like to make one last comment to be clear.

This isn't about me not getting the seal though I do feel I should have won on that lot. As I said right in post one, I had already won a seal. This isn't envy or jealousy or anything like that.

I would have been very happy if they guy who actually won needed it and got it. I would have been very happy for the other guy rolling if he won. I would have been very happy for the guy that actually rolled a zero yet got the seal if he had legitimately won it in his actual roll.

My whole point was that I didn't feel that what happened was ethically sound based on not being upfront about what was going on. And I was curious to see what everyone else thought about what actually happened.

However, it doesn't seem like some people understand what actually happened.

We aren't talking about some pre-agreed upon set up or an entire party looting on something.

The scenario was three people rolling on an item. Just three. One of the other members changes their loot at the start of a run to that item without divulging that they planned to roll for one of the people who was already rolling on the item. This added an extra roll which reduces the chances of the other two players and doubles the rolls for the remaining player of the three. This is not equitable.

The omission of that information is what I had a problem with because I would not have agreed to it.

And of course, some of you do understand what actually happened and still feel what happened was ok. And while I think that is morally reprehensible, I expected at least some people to genuinely feel that way. I just didn't expect it to the level that we actually saw which was certainly interesting.

The purpose of this thread has definitely been fulfilled since I have my answers.

I thank you all for your responses.

[Miste]

How is it at the expense of others? 1/8 chance is still a 1/8 chance for everyone except the guy getting his friend's help. It's not like the person that's handing seals to his buddy is standing there doing nothing during the actual fight. They are helping everyone else have a chance at seals too.

Let's put a different spin on this and say folks who have 9 seals are not allowed to help their friends, ie not allowed to join the party at all. How many people do you think would lose out on the ability to obtain 9 seals? My guess is boatloads.

I think I understand what Molly is trying to say. Basically when you enter a Hamlet with 8 people with no rules setup, you have a 1/8 chance at anything. Keeping in mind you cannot do Hamlet with less or more than 8. Say 2/8 of those people do not need seals then that makes the 6/8 left have a 1/6 chance of a seal instead of a 1/8, BUT, that is just LUCKY for them that two people happen to be there just for gear. Because you could quite possibly join a party where all 8 need seals. Say you go into Hyrstmill with 8. This time they setup who is lotting on what and you can only pick one thing. 2/8 people pick Militia Robe. 1/8 picks Hamlet Cutter Hat. 5/8 pick seals.
So the people lotting Robe have 1/2 chance
The people lotting Cutter Hat have 1/1 chance
The people lotting Seals have 5/8 chance
If you happen to be in the group lotting seals, unfortunately you have worse luck than the other people in the group, cause unfortunately you joined a group that more people needed seals, BUT, you are still lucky that not ALL 8 needed seals. Then same scenario, say one of the people lotting Robe changed their mind and changed it to a Seal. You got unlucky they happened to want a seal too, but the other person lotting Robe got lucky they changed their lot, since now they are 1/1 for the Robe. So what Molly was trying to say was no matter where that 8th persons lot goes, it will lower one other persons %, but it will up someone elses. You cannot do Hamlet with 7, so that 8ths persons lot roll has to go somewhere. Where they choose may be lucky, or unlucky for one individual.

I sympathize with OP that the parties in question did not express their intentions because then the group could decide where they stand on letting them do that, but Wynn don't worry, you'll get your seals soon I am sure ^^

[Hanabira]

i dont think its any of your business if he plans on keeping it or passing it to a friend. he doesnt owe you any explanation as to why he changes his lot, you said he could change it, he did and just so happen to have won. i can -almost- see if you said no he cant change, but then got out-voted. but cmon.. you said yes.

[Molly_Millions]

Here's a good way to look at it: When doing hamlet defense, always assume everyone will roll for a seal. When it turns out that only 5 are gonna roll (even when only 4 need it) you have better chances than what you expected.

Also, fighting over drops is a good way to lose friends.

[Bublex]

Greetings,

I would like to thank you all for your comments. We feel this thread has run its course, so it will now be closed.

Regards,