Realm Reborn = downgrade?

[Kallera]

i said that i wish they would add some moving spell cast .
But yet it's really different you can't compare not moving to cast and being locked while attacking .
You never played to wow because there you would see that it works just fine , even if mages have to stop moving for frost bolt they also have instant cast that you can do while moving .

i gives no strategy at all .
"Ok the warriors only use your skills right after ifrit do the fire pillars
-but we won't do any damages !
-Ok SE up your damages now you have the same damages as black mages , oh ? ifrit died in 10 secondes with the burst !"

oh that was rokien ... didn't saw

I have played wow. Know what else I did, I stopped playing wow after a few days, and have no intention to play wow ever again.

I don't remember there being a resume required to post and make suggestions on the forum. Why aren't mages being given the same freedom? People say they want better gameplay. but gameplay is pretty damn vague. what is it that sliding around diagonally serve? what gameplay is affected by moving around on a dragonfire dive with dragoon? Why is not the same with blizzara? You are in the same boss battle, you know.

Or are the mages less deserving of such "sacrifices"?

[lololink]

you are only comparing movements it's the entire gameplay that you must compare but for the last time Animation lock is not the same thing as being force not to move in order to cast a spell .

[Kallera]

you are only comparing movements it's the entire gameplay that you must compare but for the last time Animation lock is not the same thing as being force not to move in order to cast a spell .

You are being forced to complete your action. In gameplay the behavior is very much the same. AOEs don't discriminate you know.

[Deakka]

SWTOR had a problem with animation lock, although it wasn't as severe as FFXIV. I think they had about 3 post capped threads regarding it. Right now they have animation lock included in the strategy for many fights... mainly it's because that's all they can do with the current engine. It is by no means solid or challenging gameplay (when coupled with native high ping for non JP, and constant server/client side checks for movement and abilities).

[Velhart]

Do you even play the game? We have instant casts that I can do while running..... woooooww....

Do you play the game? Every ability, spell, and weapon skill requires you to stay in place, even if it is a fraction of a second

[Kallera]

Do you play the game? Every ability, spell, and weapon skill requires you to stay in place, even if it is a fraction of a second

Yet somehow, that one is not strategic, and the sliding all over the place is, why is that?

[Ixmo]

SWTOR had a problem with animation lock, although it wasn't as severe as FFXIV. I think they had about 3 post capped threads regarding it. Right now they have animation lock included in the strategy for many fights... mainly it's because that's all they can do with the current engine. It is by no means solid or challenging gameplay (when coupled with native high ping for non JP, and constant server/client side checks for movement and abilities).

Yeah, well, it wasn't technically animation lock but rather Animation/Ability delay and how it affected gameplay. It was actually 6 threads focussing on how if they did not make the game strict to cast time and ignore animation, the game would fail. There were hundreds upon hundreds of pages with examples of why this kind of system doesn't work in an MMORPG, and is the reason why I'm direct and upfront with the way I go about speaking on behalf of the game. The primary reason is at the fact that I want this game to succeed.

The dev's replied to the topic, saying they'd do what they could, but myself and many others knew that unless they took the game down completely and redid the mechanics/engine, the issue would never be able to be fixed with the current version. After some replies, the dev's said they had fixed said issue, and it was obvious that this wasn't the case as the issue still arises even now in the game, and it's now in its downfall. People claim it was due to lack of endgame, when the truth is, it's because the core gameplay is not as smooth as it should be. You can't correctly clip spells because the game makes you wait for silly animations to complete, and that's exactly how it feels right now on FFXIV. It's playable, but it will never attract the numbers needed. Nothing says "Well, we warned you." like the 6 threads that were made.

Yoshi-P has actually listened and understands this type of feedback though, and he has made the correct choice in taking down the entire game and rebuilding it from ground up. It lets you be able to correct mistakes like this, instead of being like SWTOR - attempting to fix the primary reason people play MMORPG's, failing, and then sending the game F2P and everyone on their way.

(link to thread if anyone is interested, it's the sixth thread and has links to the previous ones in it): http://www.swtor.com/community/showthread.php?t=159300

[Zaireeka2025]

Yeah I watched that one thing I noticed they did to help achieve their smooth transitions is they have the upper and lower bodies work independently of each other, it's odd seeing him walk and do a barrel roll while his upper body maintains arrow fire animation. However, FFXIV's animations are full body so what works in GW2 won't work here without SE going back and redoing all the animations and coding to incorporate it, which just isn't going to happen when time is not on their side.

The ARR demo shows that the upper and lower body are in fact independent. Look closer please. The dragoon's legs go one way, while his upper torso goes the other. As a matter of fact, GW2 is better at keeping the legs and torso somewhat aligned (also independent of each other) while only the head is facing different directions in and out of battle. ARR needs a bit of tweaking in this dept, nothing serious there, but noticeable and makes the dragoon appear wonky.

That's also not pointing out that GW2 is graphically inferior to FFXIV, so it would naturally have room to work on smoother animations and transitions even on lower end computers while FFXIV has been known to even make high end SLI/Crossfired Video Cards sweat.

Let's just face it if it comes to sacrificing something to help make the game run smoothly on lower end PC's there's not a whole lot you can do that will make folks happy. You can't exactly dumb down the graphics, and even if they downgraded the new environment it wouldn't be flush with the characters graphic models giving it an awkward look and it would just be something else you, Nemy, or Rokien would post about saying it would ruin your "immersion".

First of all, please don't group me up with Rokien, cuz he's in a league all his own. Secondly, ARR is already able to run on lower-end computers. They've reworked the code from scratch. Gameplay mechanics have already been established, which allows for a few subtle animations to be added in. Alpha/Beta would be a great time to give the characters a little more fluidity.

Let me make one thing VERY CLEAR. Personally, 1.0 is the past and is based on old overly-complicated code. We are not asking the devs to copy/paste or force implement 1.0's code into ARR. Hellz no. We loved 1.0's animations, but it won't work in ARR... this is agreed. What we are simply saying is that a stop animation unique to ARR can be done. GW2 proves that it is possible in an MMO to have fluid-like walking animations outside and inside of combat with no lag. It's really just a subtle 1-2 second additions of foot placement that should be coded to be overwritten by any next command prompt entered. Nothing major. Simply stopping altogether is just too noticeable and robotic. Unfinished. Unpolished. Especially after 1.0's experience. They are following too closely into WoW territory with character animation expectations.

Again, we're not comparing the animation quality here (obviously SE will make better looking animations), but proving that gameplay doesn't have to be affected by movement stop animations if upper/lower animations are properly timed and aligned, and actions overwrite on command.

GW2: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fg5Rx9RpS9k

ARR: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjqmc4c8m3Y

[JGwinters]

I do not want my character to move like a robot. .___.
Part of the reason FF players call their characters characters instead of toons like in most other games..is not the animation quality part of it? The feeling of being something more than a stick figure?

And for me personally, if we lose the ability to run as we wish and are forced to backpedal painfully slowly when trying to move towards the camera...yes, it will be a big part of why I finally quit. Restricting gameplay now, are we, SE? :/
I can't think of a single instance when you'd be needing backpedaling out of combat. And we already have backpedaling in combat.

I think the decision to go for generic over quality in character animation and controls is a good example of the game's current direction. If you copy MMOs that one after another keep failing after a couple months, how long can you expect your game to go on? There's many things that require changing in this game. Why do you have to go and yet again get rid of one of the aspects that didn't need anything done about it...

[Webster]

I wonder if it's a budget issue? Is it expensive to capture animation? Would it delay the game?

I think i read somewhere that Yoshi P didnt want to officially show the gameplay footage because it looked like every other MMO...That gave me hope that he was refering to the animation...Guess that's not the case.

Im Pretty dissapointed that this is the direction the animation is going. Ill give it a try, if its too distracting guess ill find my fix somewhere else. That's really all any of us can do. It's just a drag that i put in so much time, with the intentions on "being ready" when 2.0 launches and there is a possibility i wont even play.

Devs please consider how important of an issue this is to a lot of people.