Ethical Necromancer Job?

[Chasingstars]

If what arcanists, summoners, and pictomancers do is basically a lower grade form of creation magic than what the ancients could do, then couldn't a necromancer just do that but using the mere concept of like a ghost or a skeleton? As something created that way wouldn't be the real thing, therefore it wouldn't be an undead in the traditional sense, it merely resembles and behaves like the idea of it.

And further it would mean in terms of ethics its mostly clean aside from the appearance, as there is no graverobbing or interacting with souls or actual ghosts or cadavers.

After all blue magic in tural is a different process than that of the skalla did, as skalla was more blood curses and monstrous transformation, while the tural version is the safer version through soul resonance. So hypothetically a branching evolution of a different practice of necromancy that could be a job that warrior of light takes because its not mhach-style necromancy.

And if we take this one step further, with what I am cooking, then what about electrope? After all, the vana'diel raid was with electrope, it was all simulated, but made to seem lifelike based on the memory of what vana'diel was. And electrope is an evolved form of the same south seas style of magic that the milalla developed in the first place and to the player is introduced as the arcanist job.

EDIT: Since electrope is also electricity dependent, such a job could dabble in a bit of astral-based mage and you get lightning magic to go with the concept. If a job like that did exist, then we just take the noulith technology of sage for pinpoint personal aether usage. If these electrope creations could make use of food like how Prishe did, or similarly to Zero eating an apple, then hypothetically the job could also be green energy if all its required to keep one active is stuff like a normal lightning storm or eating something like an apple. Which thinking on this, this is kind of taking the aesthetic of Mhach but powering it with Amdapor style golem magic.

[Cleretic]

I mean that's not really a 'necromancer', that's a summoner with an aesthetic.

[RedLolly]

I think Reaper was an answer to this desired job, and it's entirely down to the avatar being a willing party in the contact. It's just very unfortunate it's a melee, I think.

Necromancer is already a job in the game (Edda likely counts and Alaqa literally was) and they go in depth why there really isn't an ethical route for it.

Grave rights and dealing with the dead properly is a huge deal in Thaumaturgy, and thus a part of Black Mage. Mhach starting to deal with Void magic was doing a Reaper contract wrong by enslaving the Voidsent (who we now know are just people) and Amdapor got close in their own way by animating statues and other stone objects. Bones aren't much of a technical jump there, thus Alaqa taking to Conjury so fast.



We're still a week out, but I really hope giving us full aesthetic sets for spell effects is an option with Evercold with those animation unlocks. Then we could be a dark/necromancer type mage without actually breaking natural law.

[Chasingstars]

I mean that's not really a 'necromancer', that's a summoner with an aesthetic.

True. I suppose with summoner old summoner was affliction but could've been a necromancer with its old gameplay.

I think Reaper was an answer to this desired job, and it's entirely down to the avatar being a willing party in the contact. It's just very unfortunate it's a melee, I think. Mhach starting to deal with Void magic was doing a Reaper contract wrong by enslaving the Voidsent (who we now know are just people)

Yeah, reaper is similar to what I was talking about of tural vs skalla but this being garlemald vs mhach in terms of branching practices.

Necromancer is already a job in the game (Edda likely counts and Alaqa literally was) and they go in depth why there really isn't an ethical route for it.

I agree traditional necromancy as shown in game is unethical. As they literally work with the dead.

Grave rights and dealing with the dead properly is a huge deal in Thaumaturgy, and thus a part of Black Mage.

Right as they are very much tied to Naldthal and by extension the afterlife. Which means they are much familiar with the concepts of death, funeral rites, etc.

Amdapor got close in their own way by animating statues and other stone objects. Bones aren't much of a technical jump there, thus Alaqa taking to Conjury so fast.

Mhm. And Amdapor magic is kind of like a prototype version of electrope where the ability to give the inanimate life but its rocks instead of cadavers.

We're still a week out, but I really hope giving us full aesthetic sets for spell effects is an option with Evercold with those animation unlocks. Then we could be a dark/necromancer type mage without actually breaking natural law.

Yeah who knows about that aspect. As those spell aesthetics certainly could enable a new kind of era for jobs in terms of presentation.

[Cleretic]

Necromancer is already a job in the game (Edda likely counts and Alaqa literally was) and they go in depth why there really isn't an ethical route for it.

Grave rights and dealing with the dead properly is a huge deal in Thaumaturgy, and thus a part of Black Mage. Mhach starting to deal with Void magic was doing a Reaper contract wrong by enslaving the Voidsent (who we now know are just people) and Amdapor got close in their own way by animating statues and other stone objects. Bones aren't much of a technical jump there, thus Alaqa taking to Conjury so fast.

The game also just hates necromancy, in totality, in all of its forms.

If FFXIV has ongoing themes across its entire run, one of them is 'the dead should stay dead'. While the game is often sympathetic towards the concept that someone would want to bring back what was lost, either in terms of the literal dead or more conceptual stuff like fallen empires or an idealized past, it's always a doomed idea to actually go through with it; that it's always more dangerous than it's worth, destroys the present to try to bring back the past, and frequently doesn't even work.

We'd never get a Necromancer job not just because there's no 'good' Necromancer, but also because the game itself kinda fundamentally disagrees with their existence.

[Zero-ELEC]

I mean, Lhu beastmasters are necromancers in all but name. They trap souls and use them them in weapons. It's not even that they don't use "spoken" souls, we see them trap minotaurs and voidsent in the Crucible.

And Kornago beastmasters do get to "tame" ashkin, which, while not always souls, are the aetheric remains of deceased creatures. That's a sort of necromancy, I guess.

[Burmecia]

why people wanna be necromancers without necro part? sounds like poser attitude

[Alkonium]

In the Guild Wars games, Necromancer was a playable class (called a Profession) since the beginning, and it didn't bother anyone. I don't see why FFXIV can't manage that. And it included making minions out of slain enemies.

[Kranel_San]

In the Guild Wars games, Necromancer was a playable class (called a Profession) since the beginning, and it didn't bother anyone. I don't see why FFXIV can't manage that. And it included making minions out of slain enemies.

They can go out of their way to have a Revenant inspired job and rename it 'Necromancer' wherein uses the power of memories of the deceased (Like, Imagine calling forth Ysayle for ice-attacks, or Haurchefant for protection, or Emet-Selch as a Limit-break)

That'd be sick!

[Cleretic]

In the Guild Wars games, Necromancer was a playable class (called a Profession) since the beginning, and it didn't bother anyone. I don't see why FFXIV can't manage that. And it included making minions out of slain enemies.

You seem to assume the developers not doing Necromancer is entirely reactive; that they'd be happy to, but they think other people wouldn't like it.

No, the fact of the matter is the devs don't want to do Necromancer. They drew their lines, they have things they don't want to do, and 'Necromancer as a job' is one of them. The reason given when they said this was that they don't want 'evil' jobs, and yeah, that's fair: necromancer is the most definitionally evil job you can get, there is no way you can do it that isn't evil, and that's before you get into what I've said earlier, that the game fairly consistently hates everything about necromancers, even when you get into the abstracts.