lore-friendly transitioning methods

[RaionKansen]

Biology is not binary and science continues to prove that it is a spectrum. And as more and more people get the care they need, the spectrum will continue to widen until people can no longer deny that intersex people or even animals that can change sex are not rare but actually more common than it’s given credit for. Denying this reality is the most harmful to humanity, and there is a lot that can be done about not causing someone pain or depression. For example by not denying the existence of non-binary. Denying this truth seems more like personal gain than it does promoting the well being of all. It is also silly and very strawman to think that my argument advocates for pushing kids to transition just because they like other kids toys. The advocating is for allowing children to be themselves and not forcing beliefs on a mind that is trying to develop. From the perspective that kids are being brainwashed sounds like people are scared of something they do not understand and would prefer putting children in conversion therapy over letting/supporting a child explore their inner most feelings without constraints. I see contradictory ideas that promote individuality and uniqueness in the same message that advocates for the eradication of the spectrum. So before people start to claim science on their side, they should first ask themselves what is most important: living free, happy, and included or segregated, bullied, and erased.

It is a binary. Science continues to support this. There is no spectrum.
You don't seem to understand what a binary is. Something that is either male, or female, or a mix of both, is still within the binary of male and female. It doesn't create a third thing; rather, its an exceptional case where the body is still fighting to be male, or female, or the lack of / overproduction of both hormones makes the body completely dysfunctional. Not just with their sex organs, but with other basic things like nutrient retention, bone density, and your immune system. Medical intervention is then required, which still ultimately will attempt to push the body to accept more testosterone (male) or estrogen (female) as its primary hormone. Sometimes that also doesn't work and gets more complicated. If anything, saying that you can just choose to identify or be non-binary is gross narcissism and insulting to those with real, physical, medical challenges

Trans ideology lost/is losing most of its ground because of the refusal to leave kids alone. I have no issue saying that I want to eradicate the grooming and manipulation of children. I did not strawman you. Just because you don't have a good response doesn't mean you've been strawmanned.

You seem very confused, do you care about science or feelings? You keep saying science proves your narrative (it doesn't), but your last comment is arguing that being "happy" is more important than science?

By the way, every time a university gets a large grant to research the results of transitioning children they find that the overwhelming majority suffered from the experience. They refused to publish their studies in the name of "not being political" (and because some of that research would incriminate them). Most children would live perfectly normal lives just growing up and being gay, or just being more feminine/masculine than the average boy/girl.

[RaionKansen]

Non-heteronormativity is everywhere in FF14. It's just subtle enough to not ruffle Chinese censors.

To be fair, some of this is a big part of the bastardization of the EN localization. The Germans and French are bigger weebs than us and their localization is closer to the Japanese in most cases.
Most of this is not found in the other langauges of the game. The further you go back, the worse it is too. Moenbryda's minion description had to be updated because in Japanese was somber talking about Urianger mourning the loss of his childhood friend while the English implied that he used it as a fleshlight.....

LGBT is largely still a punchline to the Japanese. They insert it when they think its funny, not to normalize it.

[Hazelx3]

To be fair, some of this is a big part of the bastardization of the EN localization. The Germans and French are bigger weebs than us and their localization is closer to the Japanese in most cases.
Most of this is not found in the other langauges of the game. The further you go back, the worse it is too. Moenbryda's minion description had to be updated because in Japanese was somber talking about Urianger mourning the loss of his childhood friend while the English implied that he used it as a fleshlight.....

LGBT is largely still a punchline to the Japanese. They insert it when they think its funny, not to normalize it.

What does it exactly mean that it was a punchline to the Japanese? You mean like from Anime where they make trap characters or something? My english isnt that good so I dont really get it

[Arwen2]

It is a binary. Science continues to support this. There is no spectrum…

Again, all outlying studies that do not account for the many children/teens lives that have been saved. I don’t ignore the cases where certain people have complications, but I also acknowledge that there are so many other studies that prove that with proper care, a long happy life can be lived. And I bring up happiness as a relevant topic because when we all act and speak like human beings, we can see the difference in a happy person versus a sad person and the enormous difference in can make on health. It is a straw man argument when I am advocating for an environment where children can be their true selves and you say that it is equivalent to forcing a child to transition because they like a specific gendered toy. Fostering vs grooming/manipulation are very different things, I’m sure most people can understand that. Your basis is coming from extreme cases, which alienates a large chunk of real people with real experiences. Telling someone they are either this or that and nothing else is a slippery slope and we all know where that type of thinking leads to.

[Arwen2]

nature absolutely has massive variety in phenotypes and how procreation is arranged, and disorders in individual development shuffle the deck too-- if one wants to account every possible and even theoretical variation…[/color]

Hello! Happy to know that you’re doing well, truly. Just want to clarify that I am not denying cases where complications can lead to death or other medical issues. Just pointing out that the world is not black and white, words of inclusion are invited, and ideas that box a colorful spectrum of people into two little cubbies is bullying.

[RaionKansen]

What does it exactly mean that it was a punchline to the Japanese? You mean like from Anime where they make trap characters or something? My english isnt that good so I dont really get it

It means that it's done as a joke basically. I think anime/otaku culture has accepted and normalized a lot of LGBT things, but for live action TV and the rest of their media, its mainly just using things like crossdressing as a point of humor. Like the character very obviously looks like a man, but everyone in the skit is treating them like a woman and is trying not to break character.

[RaionKansen]

Again, all outlying studies that do not account for the many children/teens lives that have been saved. I don’t ignore the cases where certain people have complications, but I also acknowledge that there are so many other studies that prove that with proper care, a long happy life can be lived. And I bring up happiness as a relevant topic because when we all act and speak like human beings, we can see the difference in a happy person versus a sad person and the enormous difference in can make on health. It is a straw man argument when I am advocating for an environment where children can be their true selves and you say that it is equivalent to forcing a child to transition because they like a specific gendered toy. Fostering vs grooming/manipulation are very different things, I’m sure most people can understand that. Your basis is coming from extreme cases, which alienates a large chunk of real people with real experiences. Telling someone they are either this or that and nothing else is a slippery slope and we all know where that type of thinking leads to.

SOME being "saved" is irrelevant when MOST suffer. These are studies done by the most liberal universities in America. The goal is to focus on the positive results and they struggle to find enough to publish their works. The idea that a child will self-harm because they're not allowed to transition is completely unfounded by any research. The only research we have is that children, and adults, are MORE likely to self-harm the further into the processes they are.

There are no studies proving that a long, happy, life can be lived. No one has lived long enough with the modern medicine available. Its crazy that people don't seem to understand that these clinics love getting lifelong patients. They're doing it for a financial incentives.

Children are always their true selves, but they dont always know what words mean. I wanted to "marry" my (male) cousin (male) when I was like 6 years old because he was my best friend. All it took was my mom saying "oh you can't get married, thats not what marriage is. you can still be best friends though." and me just going "okay". I've only ever been sexually attracted to women my entire life and I'm married. Parents are in charge of dictating their child's reality. It is grooming. It is manipulation. You are pulling them to something they have no business being involved in so you can use them as a human-shield for sympathy and go "BUT THE CHILDREN". Yes, BUT THE CHILDREN...should be left alone. My wife and I are now trying to take steps to start a family in the next 2-3 years. Thank God I didn't have a stupid mom trying to make me a girl for something I said when I was 6.

What extreme cases have I provided?

A "slippery slope" to what?

[Coletergeist]

I would ignore Raion and their gross amount of misinformation. This thread has also been very much derailed by this point.

[RaionKansen]

I would ignore Raion and their gross amount of misinformation. This thread has also been very much derailed by this point.

What am I misinformed about?

[Arwen2]

… “Slippery slope” isn’t a fallacy, it’s a core part to critical thought. Funny enough, calling it a fallacy to try and win an argument is a fallacy in itself.

“Most” absolutely do not suffer. Again, I am not saying all children will self harm if they cannot transition, nor am I saying that any child who says they want to marry their best friend at 6 years old means force transitioning. That is absurd. Research has shown that self harm at any age for LGBTQIA+ , stems from a lack of support. Parents are in charge of making sure their children eat, sleep, have a roof over their heads, and that they do not harm themselves, whether it’s falling off a jungle gym or playing with fire. It is not a parents job to dictate their thoughts and reality, it is a parents job to nurture their reality and nourish creativity. Their true nature will flourish on its own if the environment cares for it. A slippery slope is 100% not a core part of critical thought, and that is frightening to even see it in writing.