Please Reconsider Splitting Main and Off-Tank Roles Based on Job

[Derio]

With all the negative feedback on this topic. I think if they dont have a good showing of the other tanks and how MT and OT can work together in content live on stream, then I can see them rolling back this entire thing and just keeping it how it is with all tanks being able to MT or OT.

[RaionKansen]

With all the negative feedback on this topic. I think if they dont have a good showing of the other tanks and how MT and OT can work together in content live on stream, then I can see them rolling back this entire thing and just keeping it how it is with all tanks being able to MT or OT.

I don't think they're going to pay much attention honestly.
People are going off such a small amount of information and working themselves up for no reason.

We will probably have to wait until we see the other tanks and more realistically, wait until we can actually get into the first tier of Savage.

They also have to find some way to address there being 5 tanks and making it so there's at least some reason people might not want to just run 2 of the highest dps tanks for everything. Maybe people will still do that, but maybe it will cause the healers or the rest of the party to suffer because of it. Who knows, the content isnt out yet.

[Rithy255]

I do not understand how Dark Knight, who's design has encouraged counterattacking since its FFXIV debut, is supposed to be a supportive tank, but Paladin is a counterattacking tank. Despite it's supportive fantasy and it continues to have Passage of Arms (with an AoE heal added to it). This is not the complaint of a salty DRK main. It's actually my second favorite tank. PLD is the job I raided savage on.

I mean I agree as a PLD main I love the jobs protector vibe; I think design wise outside of DT's 2 minute meta and PLDS rotation feeling a bit bland to me the job felt perfect, Now it feels like PLD's getting forced to be a selfish tank compared to other tanks which to me just makes no sense for PLD.

I'm really against the idea of forcing tanks into MT or OT roles it just feels stupid, it was bad with the pure/barrier healer split too, frankly It did not make healer more interesting it just made astro bland while making white mage the same and scholar the same while adding another scholar.

When people say we want more job identity that's true, but wanting more job identity isn't forcing jobs into different sub categories, Frankly forcing PLD to be a MT just restricts how I play the game and makes the game worse because I enjoy flexing to MT and OT.

With all the negative feedback on this topic. I think if they dont have a good showing of the other tanks and how MT and OT can work together in content live on stream, then I can see them rolling back this entire thing and just keeping it how it is with all tanks being able to MT or OT.

No we're screaming at walls here frankly, don't expect any changes for a long while. I mean look at healer mains they've been screaming for improvements for ages and haven't got anything.

[Oizen]

If it goes poorly, they will address feedback on it surely. But not until 9.0.

A big issue that got XIV into the rut its in right now is the devs aren't all that great at pivoting quickly.

[Atreus]

Honest question. What do you all think has been the case for the last 13 years of this game's history, besides the player base deciding what the optimal main and off-tank is at a given time for higher-end content? What do you think is happening right now, besides SE simply designing around that? Do you think that designated off-tanks are going to be completely incapable of tanking? Really?

Saying this again, it's ego and uncertainty that are driving this conversation.

[Sayurichan]

People need to relax until more details are available. By my best guess, "main tank" simply means most likely two things

1) Having slightly better self-protection and
2) Having more "counter attacks" than off-tanks (use a "defend" skill like Shelltron, get hit, able to do a counter skill)

If that's the case that does not mean you won't be able to tank as an "off-tank", you just won't have the "counter attack" play style. And with off-tanks having less self-protection, yet still able to survive tank busters, it could mean healers would need to spend 1 or 2 more GCDs to heal after a tank buster, reducing the advantage of taking two off-tanks for higher damage.

With this, I don't mind this change, quite the contrary. We'll just have to wait and see until more details are available.

[Rithy255]

Honest question. What do you all think has been the case for the last 13 years of this game's history, besides the player base deciding what the optimal main and off-tank is at a given time for higher-end content? What do you think is happening right now, besides SE simply designing around that? Do you think that designated off-tanks are going to be completely incapable of tanking? Really?

Saying this again, it's ego and uncertainty that are driving this conversation.

I feel like your missing the entire point here and that its not ego.

I'm a PLD main and don't want to be pushed into the MT role only, as I like to flex on Paladin, a lot of wars/gnb/drks feel the same way they dont want to just be put into one box.

If the offtanks are fairly capable of tanking then MT becomes entirely useless which is a key issue you'd just run two Offtanks for the extra party support.

People need to relax until more details are available. By my best guess, "main tank" simply means most likely two things

1) Having slightly better self-protection and
2) Having more "counter attacks" than off-tanks (use a "defend" skill like Shelltron, get hit, able to do a counter skill)

If that's the case that does not mean you won't be able to tank as an "off-tank", you just won't have the "counter attack" play style. And with off-tanks having less self-protection, yet still able to survive tank busters, it could mean healers would need to spend 1 or 2 more GCDs to heal after a tank buster, reducing the advantage of taking two off-tanks for higher damage.

With this, I don't mind this change, quite the contrary. We'll just have to wait and see until more details are available.

People shouldn't really just relax until more details are available they should have explained the vision better if they wanted people to relax.

Also yet again if offtanks can main tank pretty well then MT becomes entirely useless where you should bring two OT's for the added party mitigation which is more important.

funny thing is people like the flexibility of being able to MT and OT, Tanks shouldn't have to be split to be "unique"

[Atreus]

I feel like your missing the entire point here and that its not ego.

I'm a PLD main and don't want to be pushed into the MT role only, as I like to flex on Paladin, a lot of wars/gnb/drks feel the same way they dont want to just be put into one box.

For most, no, I'm really not.

Cool, so I'm sure you noticed Intervention applying the same Surcoat of Satisfaction buff. And Cover having such a short cooldown. What I see tells me you'll be just fine OT'ing if that's what you want.

[Rithy255]

For most, no, I'm really not.

Cool, so I'm sure you noticed Intervention applying the same Surcoat of Satisfaction buff. And Cover having such a short cooldown. What I see tells me you'll be just fine OT'ing if that's what you want.

I mean its really not about ego. Its about how warrior will likely be made to play off tank a lot more, not everyones going to be happy with that; I also like flexing to MT/OT.

And if PLD's intervention applies the same buff then whats even the point of making it a MT? Just seems like a very odd choice to me.

[Messiah601]

Just another WAR main here who prefers to MT:
This change will bring more restriction to the role than it is worth, as it did with pure/shield healers. I think the correct move would be to give both tanks and healers a stance to swap into if they're dead set on MT/OT and pure/shield. Personally, I don't think the tank role has ever been in a better state than it is now and although I'm super excited for the big mix-up that Evolved mode will bring to combat, I'm equally concerned that my favorite job/role (WAR/MT) will feel much worse in 8.X.