Normal editor tools. When?

[Moon_Rabbit]

Is the thing if the players want anything that makes them stand out standardized then how can you stand out? What's if the players found another glitch that innovate , right? Just like the lofts that helped innovate housing, we're gonna demand that be standardized and given to everyone.So that you've then standardized the innovation.

In a game where the only innovation was the loft , what innovations next? People say innovation's gonna come , but has no idea what innovation even looks like looks like. Especially when they asked for the master key that never tells them no.

You can't break limits when there are none, you can't innovate when there's nothing to innovate. It's a perfect tool with no flaws. If you're trying to make a system with no friction. It's like trying to write a story about a omnipotent perfect God main character. They're boring characters , because there's no friction to give them texture. It's a flat character that offers no pushback , no questions no conundrum to work out. People loved flawed character , because you can see the struggle , the growth, the relation.

If they do put the z,s in game , it doesn't change anything , and just simply devalues the work done by those who mastered the system over time, but also flattens out the skill curve.

I don't know, people say we're going to find another innovation? Anything you innovate will simply be copy/ pasted or demanded that it be standardized so everyone can create that innovation.

I'm just not a fan of the commodification of discovery is all.

You also said before:

If everyone stand out, noone stands out.

You have 3 dimensions, hundreds of housing items, different sources of light...but only glitch can bring yourself a satisfaction, just because not each player can use it, right this moment.
I don't know what to say, except suggest to throw away your pencils and brushes after future update. Seems like you're not interested in design. Your answer was as clear as possible for me.

[Solowing]

Seems like you're not interested in design. Your answer was as clear as possible for me.

I can direct you to a opticologist if you need. I argue for the friction that helps expand creativity. Were just arguing for 2 different aspects within the same thing. You want freedom, I find that limitation helps breeds the creativity. Not that its a limitation itself. As you see me telling people off in some post saying the housing size defines their capability to utilize it. You not having a glitch doesn't make you incapable of making a good room, its thinking that it does, and because of that it needs to be standardized.


Sure getting a space done in 2 hours is nice....But what left? You don't get that bit of remorse when you finish a project? WHen you're happy you're finished but you're bummed because their no more after 2 weeks of turning your space into a random assortment of random crap Strawn throughout the space. And watch it slowly begin to take shape, sometimes they stay, sometimes they reform into something else that suits the space even better.


Artistically its kinda like reading the prologue and then skipping to the end for the happy ending IMO. I understand people want that. But I get the uncomfortable feeling about it. Like wheres the soul? Rather then what's the end result? I see it but I no longer feel it.

There's a guy on YouTube that doesn't shorts about F1 Racing and the FFA and the ABSOLUTELY BONKERS things the engineers do, to bend the rules to the limits, and in that you find innovation. Not by throwing the rulebook itself out, but getting creative with its interpretation of the rules, to innovate past them

[Aelin_Ashryver]

I'd love them expanding the tools so we can place things freely without the hassle of glitches. And we know they've at least mentioned it, but with the snails pace they work on housing I don't expect that to be brought in for another couple years. Guild wars 2 housing has a lot more freedom in placement which is nice, something like that would be cool. Esp since they can also alter the size of the objects too. The creativity gw2 players have been able to show due to the freedom it has is nutty. Having to work with a jank system to express your creativity is a barrier for people that needn't be there. Whether someone is creative or not is not dictated by their ability to tolerate annoyance. They stand out on the basis of their artistic expression, rather than dealing with a crappy limited system and that's how it should be imo.

In the meantime I finally got around to sorting my FC in chaos to buy it's house so next lotto I can start bidding on a lil plot. Probably shiro since that's the only place I don't have a house atm. Think I will try and grab one of the beachside smalls cause a few went through with 0 bids this round and I expect that to remain the case for the next one. That'll bring me up to 8 houses. Not sure what theme to go with for it, I went with monster hunter/guild type idea for the mist beach plot since the collab was giving me the hunting inspiration. Might wander the wards and see if I can get any nice ideas.

[Solowing]

I'd love them expanding the tools so we can place things freely without the hassle of glitches. And we know they've at least mentioned it, but with the snails pace they work on housing I don't expect that to be brought in for another couple years. Guild wars 2 housing has a lot more freedom in placement which is nice, something like that would be cool. Esp since they can also alter the size of the objects too. The creativity gw2 players have been able to show due to the freedom it has is nutty. Having to work with a jank system to express your creativity is a barrier for people that needn't be there. Whether someone is creative or not is not dictated by their ability to tolerate annoyance. They stand out on the basis of their artistic expression, rather than dealing with a crappy limited system and that's how it should be imo.

In the meantime I finally got around to sorting my FC in chaos to buy it's house so next lotto I can start bidding on a lil plot. Probably shiro since that's the only place I don't have a house atm. Think I will try and grab one of the beachside smalls cause a few went through with 0 bids this round and I expect that to remain the case for the next one. That'll bring me up to 8 houses. Not sure what theme to go with for it, I went with monster hunter/guild type idea for the mist beach plot since the collab was giving me the hunting inspiration. Might wander the wards and see if I can get any nice ideas.

I just ask they, make it something I can toggle into. I want to keep it that way I have it.

[CidHeiral]

You mistakening "I dont see it that way" with "I don't understand"

I find your way is hollow to me and lacks soul. and you find my process restrictive and unnecessary.

We are on 2 entirely different wavelengths. I understand you. I don't agree with it. Not you're wrong for having your perspective

IMO Art is a process not just progress. Sure. I can create my character in chatgpt or something. But doing it with my own 2 hands and struggling every step of the way to come to the end result makes it feel more meaningful to me because its the result of what I did an every lesson along the way that got it there.

This post only further proves that you haven't understood anything I've said.

[Aelin_Ashryver]

I just ask they, make it something I can toggle into. I want to keep it that way I have it.

I wouldn't object to it. But I don't know that they would do it either. In any case, at least you enjoy it! I'll continue to suffer till something changes haha.

[Solowing]

This post only further proves that you haven't understood anything I've said.

"I dont wanna have to glitch it up, I just wanna place it"

Seems pretty self explanatory to me

[Moon_Rabbit]

I'd love them expanding the tools so we can place things freely without the hassle of glitches. And we know they've at least mentioned it, but with the snails pace they work on housing I don't expect that to be brought in for another couple years.

Im sure its shouldn't take much time for axis vector, the other tools...yes it might take years. Something like items resizing or rotation with 2 more axis.

Whether someone is creative or not is not dictated by their ability to tolerate annoyance. They stand out on the basis of their artistic expression, rather than dealing with a crappy limited system and that's how it should be imo.

Agree, the less limits of our creativity - the better the result. As a person who seen housing in GW2 , WoW, Infinity Nikkie...i can say: our currents tools is nothing but an outdated junk.

PS: Somebody here might enjoying this masochistic process, but, once again, the result will be limited even with the glitches. Physically limited, means you can't place everything where you want, or how want to (if you are not third-party user, ofc) So the result will be worse than it could be. What creator doesn't want their work to be better?

[Solowing]

PS: Somebody here might enjoying this masochistic process, but, once again, the result will be limited even with the glitches. Physically limited, means you can't place everything where you want, or how want to (if you are not third-party user, ofc) So the result will be worse than it could be. What creator doesn't want their work to be better?

Im a PlayStation exclusive user. The plot I have now doesn't even remotely resemble the idea I had in my head. Its a emergent design of having the system question me every now and again. If the system tell me "No" then I'm going to find a way around the rules, or I am going to create an emergent design because I'm pushed into a alternate path. And because I understand the effort it takes to commit to some of the designs they create. It makes it that much more impressive.

Sure, you can make a pretty layout, but if I can replicate it in half the time. Its not really that impressive. Its just a re-arrangement of styles at that point. And whatever "innovative style" you think you can come can just be replicated. Its just a matter of item X, Y, and Z axis.

But in the current system, I can see your level of commitment to your willingness to see the vision through despite the systems limitations, and if you arnt willing to deal with that annoyance. What else could you create?

The Scion's jacket for the longest time was color locked to red. It pissed me off, but I really liked the look of my Character in the jacket..So I built the style around it. An over time it really grew on me. You'd think my favorite color is Red, alas it is Blue. But because I was somewhat forced into Red as a color I've come to appreciate red, and Incoporated it as a color even IRL.

A long time ago, back in 2013. I struggled trying to find an eye color for my character. An in Abit of frustration, I said "screw it" because I didn't know what to make her eye color. So I though "just go with the emissive look, it matches her in-game counterpart anyway".

So I yanked the slider to clear out the eye, but instead it yanked the Iris to white, but left the pupils black. Wasn't what I wanted. The friction created it own emergent aesthetic. And it looked far better then what I planned for, and tried to do.



Your point of the artist shouldn't be defined by his tool is very true. But when the outcome has no weight because theirs no story to tell outside "I placed it there" Its valuing the effort spent in the journey of creating something that can be a growing experience not for in-game but RL. And to be frankly honest. Its the only place where I feel I can be at home IG lol Getting to sit in their Apt with them, helping them pick their brains for thoughts and ideas and workarounds and a shift in how they approach creativity as a problem solving method but a look into the creativity they never knew they themselves had. Its where the game feels the most enjoyable. I never have to lift an item, I get to watch the gears turn, the bits of frustration when they hit a creative brick wall, that eurika moment when they find a better alternative or a workaround. And watch them realize most of the way through a build, that the house they are standing in, matches nothing up to the reality they see and realize. They've still created exactly what they've wanted

Its not that adding a tool is bad. But you lose the friction needed for creative processing... Its just a trade off, some don't mind the trade off. I see the delayed gratification side-effect and the forced lateral thinking as a benefit in the long run.

[Moon_Rabbit]

Im a PlayStation exclusive user. The plot I have now doesn't even remotely resemble the idea I had in my head. Its a emergent design of having the system question me every now and again. If the system tell me "No" then I'm going to find a way around the rules, or I am going to create an emergent design because I'm pushed into a alternate path. And because I understand the effort it takes to commit to some of the designs they create. It makes it that much more impressive.

Sure, you can make a pretty layout, but if I can replicate it in half the time. Its not really that impressive. Its just a re-arrangement of styles at that point. And whatever "innovative style" you think you can come can just be replicated. Its just a matter of item X, Y, and Z axis.

But in the current system, I can see your level of commitment to your willingness to see the vision through despite the systems limitations, and if you arnt willing to deal with that annoyance. What else could you create?
............

I do apologize i shorten your quote, i read the whole post, previous one too, but...i can't post my reply with that symbols amount..

Your whole story, what you described, is the story of a person who gave up every time. If there was only one Red color in this game, you would live only with it, and tell us how good it is that there is such a limitation. Right?
Ppls who can't using glitches - simple left the game and found the opportunity to create their works somewhere there are no limits. They did it for same reasons why any player can do: if gameplay is boring, or the efforts is unrewarding.
Some ppls, aslo, found a way and using "prohibited no-no-thingies" to create something better than you and me (just because no limitations, and YP is closing eyes on it, we all know it). I seen the whole medium house made outside of the box, 2 floors! above the upper floor. The entire layout is completely custom, the length of rooms and corridors is twice longer than can be usually, carpets were placed where owner wanted (and they were not snapped back to the floor). This is what Limit Breaking are! I dont wan't to say that this way is right, because the rules against it, still i can understand why ppls did it. And all of us will be able to do the same after SE will add axis vector tool.

I can't understand you, you living in own "limited chamber" and don't want grow further with new tools. A dead end for me, as a creator.

UPD: there is no shame to live in a game with the limits, shame to don't ask for more features. Every other battle/land/hand discipline jobs were updated, your job - not. Why do you happy? IRL creators can make own tools, they can change many things, we can't, so all of your words around the "limits" are 100% artificial, its not even your choce, developer made it instead of you.