The fight design of AAC M3 Savage, (AKA. Tyrant Savage) fails to make fun.

[xiaomingshi]

I believe that dev's purpose of creating a savage fight is not only creating an opportunity to test players' ability of executing job's skills, reacting to "difficult" mechanics, also, dev wants players to have a sensation of success and having fun after a savage fight is cleared. Among PF community, the Tyrant savage in AAC savage series fails the above purpose significantly. Firstly, before the "Omen" mechanic, dev repeatedly uses the random weapons mechanic which is quite boring. Secondly "Omen", "Meteor Rain", "Arena Split", and even the "Stampede" mechanics are not designed overly complex to trick players. Nevertheless, dev dramatically increases the DPS check of Tyrant savage preventing players from clearing the fight after successfully handling the above-mentioned mechanics. After weeks of trying to clear a savage fight without a success, most PF players feel tired and frustrated. I believe that if dev needs to create a gatekeeping savage fight, it's better to create several fun and complex mechanics to test PF players' abilities, but players should be able to clear such a complex savage fight with week 1 or 2 gears. Dramatically increasing the DPC check without creating several complex and fun mechanics easily let players feel frustrated. I won't be surprised to see that many PF players might stop at Tyrant savage this tier and will never clear it and won't progress to start Lindwum savage. Hopefully in the future, when dev designs savage fight, they will balance well the feeling of pressure and having a sensation of success. I believe that creating a sensation of frustration for a savage difficulty level fight is not something dev wants to achieve.

[Jeeqbit]

The reason is because there were players in the party underperforming. Developers obviously design the check so that you have to be pressing your attacks as close to 99% of the time as possible, align raid buffs and not get damage downs or weakness. Without that, the check is going to feel too tight.

It's hard to filter PF properly, unfortunately.

If you're clear ready, you can actually put Clear party or C41 and [Duty Complete (Weekly Reward Unclaimed)], after maintenance, and there's a far higher chance they'll clear it than the parties you have been in. Because you know for a fact every person in it has cleared. It's a night and day difference.

[Viminal]

I cleared week 1 in pf with 2 deaths, 1 was me (nin) 1 was the dancer, so if you cant make the dps check on week 3/4 its a skill issue, as simple as that.

[MisterNublet]

I cleared week 1 in pf with 2 deaths, 1 was me (nin) 1 was the dancer, so if you cant make the dps check on week 3/4 its a skill issue, as simple as that.

The skill issue comes from dodging awful PF players due to the fact that neither m9s or m10s had any real dps check nor body check so a lot of dead weight were carried through.

The amount of times I've seen healers pulling a combined 20k dps and dps players drifting their group buffs by >20s in clear parties has been insane.

[Valence]

Anybody missing the Fausts?

[Xapapetsu]

I personally hate M11S, prog until I got past arena split has been hell. Weapons are the easiest mechanic in the entire tier, yet for some reason, it a wall for 70% of the prog parties. The first real mechanic happens at arena split, after that its just the same mechs, reverse snake prio, stretch teather and lp/pair stack. The fight itself is mechanically boring, but I will say with everyone complaining jobs are too easy, this is a reality check for them telling them they actually suck at their job.

[Xapapetsu]

The skill issue comes from dodging awful PF players due to the fact that neither m9s or m10s had any real dps check nor body check so a lot of dead weight were carried through.

The amount of times I've seen healers pulling a combined 20k dps and dps players drifting their group buffs by >20s in clear parties has been insane.

That's the truth, I played war on my alt and I'm not a tank main by any means and only had crafted gear and easily made it past the first two fights, I agree that the DPS check is virtually nonexistent, but god forbid I say that or everyone will be at my neck saying I don't know what I'm talking about.

[jimmybe29]

Players saying the DPS check in "nonexistent" on M11S are simply lucky and rolled decent players when gambling their PF members, ones who can actually do a rotation and keep uptime. But you only need 2 mediocre players, or 1 mediocre and 2 who play poorly and you just wont pass it.
It's purely rng, the DPS check IS tight for PF players simply because most are not good at doing DPS, the average player will not perform well on this fight.

I joined a clear party the other day and we barely passed the DPS check with only 1 tank death, even tho i'm geared as hell as NIN, everyone used 3 pots and used LB3 + LB2 melee, so yes the DPS check is tight and yes the average player will not perform well on this fight.

Also the fight should be 3 minutes shorter, it would fix most of the issues everyone has with the fight.

That's the truth, I played war on my alt and I'm not a tank main by any means and only had crafted gear and easily made it past the first two fights, I agree that the DPS check is virtually nonexistent, but god forbid I say that or everyone will be at my neck saying I don't know what I'm talking about.

You can pass DPS check with 5+ deaths on both fights, so yes the DPS check is nonexistent

[Ath192]

I feel savage is supposed to be a challenge. Complaining about it being challenging is a bit of an oxymoron to me. These are the exact threads that lead to us having the dungeon design we have today. When these fights get dumbed down to normal mode levels I guess we're gonna have to invent a new category just so they can bring this level of challenge back to the game?

It was by no means an impossible fight so we know it's not broken. It's just hard. Like.... the name savage would imply I guess.

[Ankhira]

I feel savage is supposed to be a challenge. Complaining about it being challenging is a bit of an oxymoron to me. These are the exact threads that lead to us having the dungeon design we have today. When these fights get dumbed down to normal mode levels I guess we're gonna have to invent a new category just so they can bring this level of challenge back to the game?

It was by no means an impossible fight so we know it's not broken. It's just hard. Like.... the name savage would imply I guess.

Comparing savage design to normal dungeons is certainly a choice. Nobody is asking for Savage to be dumbed down? I haven’t seen anyone complaining about M9, M10, or M12. The only consistent complaints are about M11, so it’s not simply people saying savage is too hard. It’s that this one fight feels a little too much for PF compared to the rest of the tier.

I haven’t progged it myself yet, but my friends are miserable doing it in PF. Is it overtuned? I can’t say myself. But when you see this many threads across multiple posts and sites all saying the same thing, there may be some truth to it. Dismissing it as a simple skill issue doesn’t make sense when good players are also saying the fight feels like a little too much. (Mostly in PF where communication isn't all there and you gamble with party members, which is probably the core issue here but still valid.)