Game pad vs Keyboard

[Hanabira]

you dont map hotbar slots to a controller, once you are in combat mode left, right, up, down on D-Pad moves the hotbar highlight

well thats what i meant by fumbling over skills. you have 3 pages of skills where most of them have mostly the same icon. blm has like 5 buffs with the same icon, its really hard to tell which is which, especially if i have to scroll over to the one i need.

the nostromo i had was perfect for this, but the analog stick and side buttons seriously strained by thumb after 20 minutes of use. im trying to find something else

[Krausus]

well thats what i meant by fumbling over skills. you have 3 pages of skills where most of them have mostly the same icon. blm has like 5 buffs with the same icon, its really hard to tell which is which, especially if i have to scroll over to the one i need.

I set my stuff up in the order I would use them, its easy with attacks since most are combos, but with buffs it can become a pain if you dont play that job very often but its really the same as KB+M if you dont play that class that often you will forget what some of the buff icons look like and have to read them ahead of time. Also I macro certain things like my surges for DRG, sentinel for WHM, stances for WAR etc.

example: if I wanted a fully buffed doomspike I would start with true thrust move over to leg sweep then down to blood for blood over to blind side over to keen flurry then up and over to doom spike. with animations I'm always on the next skill before it will allow me to use them and i spam my confirm button to use them as soon as I'm able.

if you also notice i keep things categorized like all my - hate abilities together in one area

[Rannie]

I was there remember rofl

[Krausus]

well thats what i meant by fumbling over skills. you have 3 pages of skills where most of them have mostly the same icon. blm has like 5 buffs with the same icon, its really hard to tell which is which, especially if i have to scroll over to the one i need.

the nostromo i had was perfect for this, but the analog stick and side buttons seriously strained by thumb after 20 minutes of use. im trying to find something else

Also this is how I run my BLM

http://www.xivpads.com/?Specs&518

attack buffs below my thunder chain
heal abilities below that (or above thunder chain)
- hate abilities centered for easy access from my thunder or fire chain
protection spells all the way to the right for easy access from the left or right side of the hotbar
resonance near my AOE abilities to increase AOE area

[Hanabira]

thats a pretty good setup

[Krausus]

thats a pretty good setup

its really all about preference and the ability to know when to go up or down to achieve your next move in a quick way, like say I needed to cure and I'm currently on thunder, well I wouldn't hit down x2 I would just hit up once to get to second wind or to go from thunder to say featherfoot, I would go left once and then up once.

If your used to playing one way I wouldn't recommend changing to another unless you are really dead set on doing so as there is no noticeable benefit in either play style. They are both good, but if you do plan to play on both PC and PS3 when it is realeased I suggest getting used to a controller asap because the transition might be a bit frustrating.

[Lux_Rayna]

how do you guys with controllers deal with fumbling over skills? i was considering doing xbox360 controller with keypad addon for this.. id PREFER ps3 with keypad, but the 0-9 keys are far too out of reach

lol practice. Firstly, you have to spend a good chunk of time mapping out your action bar in the *rough* order youll use skills. This means that you have to have a set rotation in your head. If you don't have a rotation yet, definitely think of one. Fights are so much easier when what you are going to do is basically automatic. Less you have to think about the better. Once you have that rotation hammered down, its a matter of picking an order. I set my action bar up a bit unconventional. Instead of placing everything in a row, I made it into a box. I'll use my Bard as an example.

Action bar 1: 1 Song, 2 Song, 3 Light shot, 4 Shadow Bind, 5 Barrage

Action bar 2: 1 Rain of Death, 2 Quick Knock, 3 Heavy Shot, 4 Leaden Arrow, 5 Wide Volley, rest are filler

Action Bar 3: 1 Blood Letter, 2 Gloom Arrow, 3 Piercing Arrow, rest are filler

Raging Strike and Quelling strike are on macro.

The rotation is as follows: (Raging, Light Shot x3)*, Quelling, Light Shot, Raging, Barrage, Light Shot

As you can see above, those are all very easy to hit. Very little movement. It gets better though.



My first combo is rain of death. So from Light Shot, I hit down on Dpad straight into Heavy Shot. Up on Dpad to hit light Shot. Down on dpad and left one to hit next skill. Up on Dpad an right one to light shot. Down on Dpad and left two for Rain of Death. Up on Dpad and Right two to Light Shot. As you can see it forms a neat and easy pattern. Basically you dont have to know what the icon is, because you know the order. Its like memorizing a cheat code on those old console games: A, Down, A, Up, A, Down, Left, A, Up, Right, A, Down, Left, Left, A, Up, Right, Right, A. I tried to make the movement easy, like a box, so it would be easy for my fingers to memorize. The Idea was that I'd always return to the Light Shot bar because thats where my songs were. So If I had to interrupt my combo for any reason, the songs were right there for use. Continuing was easy, because my next combo is in the same sorta pattern.

Bloodletter combo is next, Wide volley combo is last, Shadowbind is filler if I have spare tp. If you're bored, look at how I have it mapped above and see how the rest of the pattern works out.





*This only applies if Raging Strike is not charged from the last battle. Otherwise this step is skipped.

[ispano]

No. You. Cant lol.

First of all precision with a mouse is entirely dependent on the user. I thought we were leaving player skill out of the discussion.

Secondly an MMO does not require aiming..only on/off targetting. Hitting a button is faster and does not miss. Ever. Moving and clicking is clearly inferior to hitting a button. Mouse is only good where aiming is required...like an fps.

Thirdly, regardless of how many buttons your mouse has, if you are using it to point and click it is inferior.

Finally, a gamepad is superior to a mouse for the same reasons. Buttons are faster than point and click. They never miss. They can do everything a mouse can +more.

Precision of a mouse is based on the specs of it's hardware before any user touches it. And most are already higher than what a Controller offers.

Correct, no aiming. Selecting a single target with one action, versus cycling through targets to get the one you want with multiple button presses.

Inferior HOW? You keep going on about if you do this or do that, it's not about all that. It's about what CAN be done, what the hardware enables. Not what user A fails at.

Buttons are faster than point and click.... I said you don't click your abilities with a mouse. I won't chastise for it, but most will. You use the keyboard for actions and general movement, mouse for turning, targeting and actions if you have the extra buttons for it. Buttons never miss, so these buttons can move to the right target in a single motion? No, they cannot.

Again, as long as you keep putting the human element into it, you'll come out with arguments like this. One piece of hardware is superior to another for specific tasks. You bring a person with opinions and preferences into it and you get this.

So.
Yes. I. Can.

[Ricky]

Mouse and keyboard superior in all situations, even moreso in 2.0 I'm sure

[ispano]

Here, let's do it this way.

Two players, one with a controller, the other with keyboard+mouse. Both are sitting in front of a group of say 6~ mobs. You want to target one in the middle and cast a spell. Said spell may or may not be on your active bar. Show the steps needed for each player.