Here we go again

[Atma]

The content also requires less team interaction. Back then you could ask whether or not you wanted to clear side rooms or get more mobs for optional xp or rewards.

And the answer, as it has been since time immemorial, was 'no', because it was never worth it. And I vehemently hate, and have always hated, 'skippable' content in dungeons, especially when it utilized what was functionally exploits to skip it. Wildstar was huge on that, it was just awful.

You could talk and give advice on how to better tank or position mobs or bosses, or just about how to deal with specific things in general.

The notion that you 'can't talk or give advice' etc is a myth pushed by people who got banned for toxic 'advice' delivered in the same scathing manner as it was in other MMOs. No one is getting banned for saying 'can you please tank it to the north' or 'can you please slow down I'm struggling.' or anything like that. The reality is that people don't really need to give or receive this 'advice' because collectively the gaming community has been playing MMOs for decades now. Things like "face the boss away from the party", "don't stand near the head of a butt or head of a dragon unless you need to", "Don't stand in crap on the floor" are so baked in that it's simply unnecessary to communicate these concepts unless it is something designed to specifically 'flip the script' (e.g Necropurge in Weeping City). We 'communicate less' because we don't need to communicate. If people die to something, it's usually incredibly obvious why and in the rare cases it is not, they'll eventually ask.

The notion that people 'need advice' is in and of itself kind of tiresome. Some people want to figure things out on their own or learn by trial and error. If it isn't your savage group then who cares - let them. The thrill of discovery used to be a thing in gaming, and started being smothered back as long ago as when Gamefaqs hit the scene. Just let people have fun.

[Valence]

And the answer, as it has been since time immemorial, was 'no', because it was never worth it. And I vehemently hate, and have always hated, 'skippable' content in dungeons, especially when it utilized what was functionally exploits to skip it. Wildstar was huge on that, it was just awful.

I'm not exactly going to argue for optional parts of dungeons to be back, the only point I made was that it generated interactions in parties, and that I have never seen said interactions turn sour or toxic and most people have always been happy to accommodate. I don't think that type of content had ever been an actual detriment to the game in spite of what SE may seem to think. It was such a non issue that when they finally said they "fixed" this, I was a little confused to say the least.

The notion that you 'can't talk or give advice' etc is a myth pushed by people who got banned for toxic 'advice' delivered in the same scathing manner as it was in other MMOs. No one is getting banned for saying 'can you please tank it to the north' or 'can you please slow down I'm struggling.' or anything like that. The reality is that people don't really need to give or receive this 'advice' because collectively the gaming community has been playing MMOs for decades now. Things like "face the boss away from the party", "don't stand near the head of a butt or head of a dragon unless you need to", "Don't stand in crap on the floor" are so baked in that it's simply unnecessary to communicate these concepts unless it is something designed to specifically 'flip the script' (e.g Necropurge in Weeping City). We 'communicate less' because we don't need to communicate. If people die to something, it's usually incredibly obvious why and in the rare cases it is not, they'll eventually ask.

The notion that people 'need advice' is in and of itself kind of tiresome. Some people want to figure things out on their own or learn by trial and error. If it isn't your savage group then who cares - let them. The thrill of discovery used to be a thing in gaming, and started being smothered back as long ago as when Gamefaqs hit the scene. Just let people have fun.

I never referred to any toxic advice or anything. You're going on a rant on something totally unrelated.

I quite bluntly implied: today, there is nothing left to give advice on when running any piece of content but extremes/savages/ultimates and even for those, you'll quickly get a raidplan to follow to the letter anyway. No need to talk ingame about it much either.

[theunhappypotato]

make the game even harder pls

[0blivion]

thread: people who somehow cannot follow an NPC in a boss fight and people who are offended when told to play the game

[Luluna]

I wish I could go back to 1.0 lol

I loved the slower battle system more akin to FFXI where I could actually think, and each job felt unique and teamwork was a must. Ifrit was so tough with Garuda and Darkhold took so much organisation it was amazing. Now I am older I do react a little slower these days but I hate all the pew pew running round it is like they cannot think of a good battle and just think lets place loads circles here ticking thing there and knockback here. I know there are a lot of younger players who will probably hate that but for me I enjoyed the slower more strategic feeling, and healers where healers not dps but you where kept on your toes every second so you did not have time to be bored.

[Ardeth]

I feel like elitism is running wild on a thread where all that was asked was an easier mode. Not a change to what you had or what you can do, but an easier mode because it was too hard for them. Or me, hell that new alliance raid sucks. I don't want to do it again. I did not find it fun. But I'm also not you guys. I don't want everything always to be as hard as possible. I do think they've lost what fun is in terms of content or job design.

[BlisteringFrost]

I feel like elitism is running wild on a thread where all that was asked was an easier mode. Not a change to what you had or what you can do, but an easier mode because it was too hard for them. Or me, hell that new alliance raid sucks. I don't want to do it again. I did not find it fun. But I'm also not you guys. I don't want everything always to be as hard as possible. I do think they've lost what fun is in terms of content or job design.

It's not elitism to say "no". It's elitism because some individuals refuse -- not can't, they refuse -- to put in the effort set as a requirement for them.

Next somebody will call this ableist before they even finished reading the entire second sentence. Stupidity is a skill. And it is not a desirable one for the grossly overwhelming majority.

[Ardeth]

It's not elitism to say "no". It's elitism because some individuals refuse -- not can't, they refuse -- to put in the effort set as a requirement for them.

Next somebody will call this ableist before they even finished reading the entire second sentence. Stupidity is a skill. And it is not a desirable one for the grossly overwhelming majority.

Not everyone is like you. I play for fun. If it's not fun I don't play. I stay in my lane so to speak. I don't want to do anything harder than normal difficulty though that differs between people, but there's this group of people that want to ruin the content I find fun when no one is asking for the content in their lane to change at all.

[BlisteringFrost]

Not everyone is like you. I play for fun. If it's not fun I don't play. I stay in my lane so to speak. I don't want to do anything harder than normal difficulty though that differs between people, but there's this group of people that want to ruin the content I find fun when no one is asking for the content in their lane to change at all.

That's nice but...

"Git gud" exists for a reason.