I can't connect with the Memories of Vanadiel

[Gwenkatsu]

The fact that he survived Zoraal throwing him into a bottomless pit at all made me close my eyes and contemplate closing the game back in 7.1.

I didn't even remember who the guy was when he turned up in the Jeuno cut scene, had to google his name
It was so absurd. Zoraal Ja can basically fell a raging bull with one single swoop, but this nameless powerless guy survived getting backstabbed by Zoraal Ja /smh
One of the many narrative low-points in Dawntrail. But as in every sunday morning cartoon show, everybody comes back, all the time, over and over and over. Except the only well written character (Gulool Ja Ja), I'm sure he will stay dead forever.

[Aco505]

I did not find this second Alliance raid that interesting story-wise, especially compared to the 7.3 MSQ. I do enjoy having more voice acting though!

The last boss seemed out of nowhere. It is based on lore from the source game and a little bit of it during the cutscenes but it still felt a bit random.

Honestly, I think the issue is that there's not enough exposition or setup to make us care or understand better and I don't think playing FFXI would improve on that part besides recognizing the original characters and places. Nier felt more involved in this regard, imho, as a someone who's never played those games but has watched some playthroughs and cutscenes.

Additionally, we barely got any extra information on the raid's storyline and the characters; the plot points are mostly the same as when Jeuno was released. However, this is usual of FFXIV side storylines, in which the vast majority of relevant information is always kept for the very end.

Mechanically speaking, I think it's a good raid but we were skipping mechanics. Granted, several players of my raid were BiS-geared raiders but mechanics should not be skipped before the boss mechanical loop starts on release day. The first boss was at like 4% on our first ever pull before the adds were summoned and the fights felt short besides the third boss, which wiped us once. I found the second encounter quite nice though.

[TheRealDesastr]

It does become tiresome for the nostalgia bait being pushed so hard when they don't blend it in well at all. I only know it's the XI raid or something and I don't care at all because I'm not interested in playing other games. I play FFXIV for FFXIV... and yes, I'm well aware they take writing from their other games and at times totally ruin a patch (looking at the horrible end of Endwalker postpatch, I hate it so much), but they could put effort into actually blending it and being original. Sigh.

Granted myths of the realm came up and the conclusion to that story was also super abysmal too :/ But there's things like the Sorrows of Werylt series that are really well written all the way through.

[Connor]

I only played FFXI briefly on-and-off, and it was longer after the dreaded level 75 Abyssea changes that I think invalidated relics or something idk. Seekers of Adoulin had just come out I think.

I loved FFXI, if not just for how weird and unique it was to play. Even the ‘clunky’ UI of everything had a certain charm to it. Subclassing was so much fun (even if it was mostly prescribed in party content).

The XI raid content hasn’t done anything (yet) to invoke any of the same feelings I had when playing the actual game. It just feels like ‘Generic FFXIV 24-Man Raid Structure #243’ with an XI skin thrown over the top for nostalgia-baiting and generating interest through trailers/visuals/etc over the actual gameplay. There’s a brief ‘oh yeah it’s [crossover area #35] (which is effectively just a backdrop)’ then back to the usual DDR and lacklustre job mechanics lol.

I miss XI lol; I don’t have a PC/Laptop anymore or I’d probably still play it. At least it was honest about what it was, hilarious entry requirements to parties and all lol.

[Catwho]

Another reason I'm actually vibing with this content is because the "Walk of Echoes" was a real zone in XI, and that's the angle they took with the integration. The raid series being named "First Walk, Second Walk" and the NPCs, zones, and bosses all being "echoes" means it's NOT just shoving XI into XIV, it's properly doing a call back to XI.

https://www.bg-wiki.com/ffxi/Categor...s_Battlefields

Even in XI, the Echoes that you fought were creatures generated from other realities, iirc.

[Jeeqbit]

They view the game as a Final Fantasy themepark and have expressed extreme enthusiasm for bringing together the different final fantasy games in FFXIV. I'm not talking about Yoshi-P either; their various designers have talked about this as well.

Their reasoning is that everyone's definition of Final Fantasy is different. If they made it like FF9, people would say it's not like the "true" FF7. If they made it like FF7, people would say it's not like the "true" FF9 or FF10 etc. So their answer is to have isolated references to different ones throughout the game.

I agree that taking inspiration and outright copying are different things. That was part of why the Star Wars 7-9 films were bad. They couldn't tell the difference between inspiration and copying. It seems they aren't the only ones to fall into that storytelling pitfall.

In SE's defense though, if they flat out copy the lore entirely, I tend to think it's so that they can say "here is this boss again, but in 2025 with modern graphics and fast combat". It's a world of difference to how they could make bosses in a 2D or partially 2D game.

[Absurdity]

They view the game as a Final Fantasy themepark and have expressed extreme enthusiasm for bringing together the different final fantasy games in FFXIV. I'm not talking about Yoshi-P either; their various designers have talked about this as well.

Their reasoning is that everyone's definition of Final Fantasy is different. If they made it like FF9, people would say it's not like the "true" FF7. If they made it like FF7, people would say it's not like the "true" FF9 or FF10 etc. So their answer is to have isolated references to different ones throughout the game.

It's nice that they're enthusiastic about it, but at the end of the day I do not care.

In my personal opinion it is a terrible design idea.
If your game is just a bunch of disconnected "content islands" made up of different FF games I don't feel any kind of connection to your "world" and consequently your game either.

Why would I care about any of the characters if they are just going to be stuck in their small pocket universe?

It doesn't expand Etheirys, it's lore, history, politics, races or cultures.
It makes the world feel incredibly small and uninteresting.

[Jeeqbit]

If your game is just a bunch of disconnected "content islands" made up of different FF games I don't feel any kind of connection to your "world" and consequently your game either.

They do technically join up the lore to FF14. Like how they joined up Ivalice to the Viera fighting Garleans, or explaining away Vana'diel as another shard that Sareel Ja saw due to being around the portal (which technically expands what we know of FF14).

But whether that's sufficient enough is up to you I suppose. Often they do just take bosses wholesale so they can show this is what a modern version of the boss would be like, in this game's battle system. I think they also want to pay maximum homage to it, so they don't bring in a character from another FF and it be hugely off and different, and huge disappointment to fans of that game.

In a way, proof that this is an issue lies in Dawntrail itself. They took FF9's lore almost wholesale, but because they dared to change it by covering it in "electrope" and leaving it in ruins, I am extremely disappointed as an FF9 fan and would have preferred it was taken wholesale than what it ended up being.

[yesnt]

tbh I forgot what the whole story is because the patch cycle is so absurdly long.

[Valence]

People need to stop with the homage bullshit, that's exactly what every hollywood studio has said to justify their slow decline into soft reboots and fan service. What kind of nauseating, anti artistic dystopian loop of thinking is this even?