Finally tried WoW

[TaleraRistain]

It's as simple as sending them a whisper when they advertise their things. There is no "SoL" situation here. They aren't a secret.

Maybe they have better communication tools now. I played from launch to MoP on Horde side and I remember there was a trade channel but it was kind of all over the place. I also didn't raid there, and I remember our trade channel was mostly concerned with those sorts of items, not things like basic bags for more casual players.

Again, there's nothing wrong with the setup for those who like that style. My preference is XIV allowing it all on a single character and then I can choose to have alts if I want them.

[ThreeBeastSmile]

If XIV wanted to crib some ideas there, they should look at EverQuest II instead. It does the system of responding to random events that they tried to do in Expert recipes much more effectively. Gathering is still boring, though. XIV does that much better.

Huh? The gathering in FFXIV is much better because you click some abilities in an even more rudimentary fashion than its crafting, then that's tied to the same tight, essentially unchanging circle for a few materials? I don't know... but simply not being bound to that dull routine makes EQ2 gathering better (to me). At least you wander about a bit. Some may like the way it's done in here, but imo it makes it unnatural and thus scuppers some immersion, and FFXIV already suffers from dustbowl levels of life in its zones.

You raise the crafting system too, that's the only crafting system in an MMO that made me not want to totally fall asleep, and what was it that made that different? As you said, one had to check for random events and respond appropriately (and on a mild timer). FFXIV's gathering system lacks sufficient randomness there (oh golly the occasional hidden slot, much excite!) even if that is simply finding a node to click on, for that essence that you're foraging for something. Oh yeah, and something else I've not seen since is a crafting station actually killing people, the forge was pretty notorious for that hue hue~

Had to cut in because I really don't see EQ2 being mentioned all that much. Really chronically underappreciated MMO for what novelties it did have, in amongst some issues - almost like anything else, go figure.

[TaleraRistain]

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(had to snip cause forums no likely how long both replies were)

You basically have the same gathering route type of system that you have in XIV. Only things really different in EQII are that you don't have Sneak so you have to slide around the mobs Eureka-style and you're in competition with others for nodes since they're not personal. But most of the other aspects about gathering were just annoying, like having to gather every node in the area to keep the ones you wanted spawning. I much prefer that you have multiple choices at a node in XIV and can choose the item you want to gather. Plus much better abilities and traits to help with increased yield. Not to mention the whole collectible system. I'm kind of half and half on the "legendary" types of items in both games. IIRC they would randomly come from nodes in EQII. And in XIV we have specific timed nodes for them. The timed nodes can be a bit annoying, but I like the guarantee of getting them on a set schedule, since so many are needed for crafted items.

The one thing they can crib from EQII for gathering is telling you on the items what tier of crafting they're used in, though that might be difficult in XIV since sometimes lower level items are used one or two expansions later in basic materials.

One thing I really enjoyed about EQII's crafting system is that the control of the craft was in your hands. You screw up and miss an event? In XIV you're basically done because of the rigid rotations. But in EQII if you lost one of the bars, you could get it back through good usage of your abilities and responding correctly to future events. If Expert recipes were more like that and less RNG, they would be much more enjoyable and would put the autonomy back into our hands by making us responsible for our success, not RNG. And yeah it was funny when the crafting station murdered you because you messed up that badly.

I think one of the most important things about gathering and crafting in XIV versus EQII is that it's still marketable to gather and craft in XIV because the game itself keeps crafted items valuable, and unfortunately EQII devalued crafted items so much that it lost that aspect.

[Tsukino]

As someone who only played WoW when it was brand new through shortly after the first expansion, I feel pretty confident in saying almost every one of those except for...I think 3, 4 (subjective), 9, and 11 is literally a quality-of-life improvement as they were added to the game at some point.

Even back when I played, the dev team did add things that were popular enough as mods directly into the game client. Instead of, you know, saying they would do that and then taking a year to add the dumbest one - chat bubbles.

I have absolutely zero interest in playing the game again, but seeing that list of things definitely adds to the frustration over here.

[XtremePrime]

Oh I've seen this before!
Yeah, during the exodus of WoW players during Shadowbringers when everyone was listing all the good stuff in FF and all the shit in WoW!
Guess we're doing the reverse now?

[Masekase_Hurricane]

Oh I've seen this before!
Yeah, during the exodus of WoW players during Shadowbringers when everyone was listing all the good stuff in FF and all the shit in WoW!
Guess we're doing the reverse now?

nah it's more pull your s*** together SE

[TeresaFortell]

Oh I've seen this before!
Yeah, during the exodus of WoW players during Shadowbringers when everyone was listing all the good stuff in FF and all the shit in WoW!
Guess we're doing the reverse now?

Competition would encourage correction in the game's trajectory.

[Molex]

Oh I've seen this before!
Yeah, during the exodus of WoW players during Shadowbringers when everyone was listing all the good stuff in FF and all the shit in WoW!
Guess we're doing the reverse now?

In any given time, you'd have a point. With dawntrail being hated even by SE HQ, both asian, european and north american player bases, and even people that don't play it anymore; no you don't have one. FF14 has been rotting ever since ShB was over, SE was happy to grab in WoW players from the shadowlands days, until they fixed their game, dropped the war within and in the meantime SE did nothing and dropped something even worse than shadowlands.

Only delusional people would think FF14 is in a good state right now. Or people that make combat bots look like top 1% players. Your pick.

[YovelaLindswood]

Oh I've seen this before!
Yeah, during the exodus of WoW players during Shadowbringers when everyone was listing all the good stuff in FF and all the shit in WoW!
Guess we're doing the reverse now?

Pretty much. Shadowlands was absolute garbage and desrved to have the playerbase cleave that it did. Bobby Kodek was a horrible game lead and deserved to get canned. I'm just glad the wow community isn't going on a crusade against xiv players trying out their game like what we experienced here, egged on by one of the major xiv streamers. Never have I seen such hate to warrant doxxing over trying out a game before.

[Raikai]

I've returned to WoW not long ago, away ever since BfA, and must say, if we overlook the innate differences between both games, WoW does provide more fun right now.

The stuff you can do at level cap have much more replayability, and there you find a much bigger spectrum when it comes to 'too easy' and 'hardcore', which is something that I miss in XIV. Can I do moderately hard stuff in groups? I can join normal raids, mythic + at 7-8. I can do the same thing solo with Delves.

Another point that the game over there beats XIV by a big margin is the OPEN WORLD. There's way more do in each zone: World Quests, zone special objectives, random easter egg findings. Rare hunting while leveling is cool and provides nice items. But most importantly, the world feels alive because they know how to design fauna in a way that isn't just 10 tigers randomly walking. Then 10 birds randomly walking, etc.

WoW's writing isn't top-tier like XIV pre-Endwalker, but I must say it's way better written nowadays than when the game was at its lowest.

Specs in WoW feel much more rich than jobs, I must say. They don't have a strict 2 min meta there, which helps a lot because specs do work 'inwards' with procs, mechanics and calculations. Even if you must adhere to a strict cooldown alignment, it's still on your own zone, not having to align with everybody else's buffs.

Housing is not live yet, but so far from the previews we got it seems to be a direct improvement from XIV's in every aspect.

The game feels more responsive in every aspect: from the menus to the combat pacing.

...

Now, to stop with all the praising, I still think XIV got an innate charm to it, stuff in WoW tend to be slightly more generic looking. The story (when good) is way more captivating. The music is light years better. Mounts do look cooler here. If we overlook stylistic preferences, items look objectively better in XIV. WoW tends to always do 'too busy, too big, too much' when it comes to armor sets, but lately they have some few nice outliers.

Availability aside, I like how gearing is more straightforward in XIV, but on the other hand I hate how meaningless melding stat customization is. PVP in WoW has a nice playstyle, but is too sick with structural issues in the rating system and premades sync-queueing for an advantage, and I actually have more fun in XIV's PVP, I just wish we had more modes, because chasing a crystal gets old fast and the large scale PVP is too chaotic to be enjoyable for me. I wish the Feast could return.

WoW may have more interesting races, but even with the current limitations + cosmetics, you can still achieve more unique characters here than there.