Thread: 8.0 and World

Originally Posted by Chasingstars

And that is the point, explore the subject matter, where maybe there is a person who doesn't want to be rejoined to have their autonomy taken. That is a goldmine for storytelling. Not engaging with that content, by contrast, is just leaving a plot thread dangling for no other reason and could be considered wasted potential in writing. After all, if goes unexplored, then why was it even brought up in the storyline? Sure it tells us we are an incomplete version of Azem, but if we do nothing with that storyline, then I could snip it out of the story and no harm comes to the story. See what I mean?

So your answer is that, because this is the only thing you could possibly imagine them doing with the Azem storyline, this must be what happens, even though nobody can put forward why it would be anything but a terrible idea on both a moral and narrative level.

I'm sorry, no. It would literally be more interesting to abandon the Azem story entirely than to do this.

Originally Posted by ShadowyZero

i hear you about the people excited about Mercydia but i think we know too much about it as is, which is why it confused me when Hades brought it up because like what more is there for us to possibly know that hasn't already been revealed or is common knowledge at this point? how would they translate it all into a compelling narrative thats supposed to span across an entire expansion?

Your entire storyline summary of Meracydia focuses on the dragons, but forgets that it's not a country of dragons. Allow me to summarize it:

-Five thousand years ago, it was host to three unique civilizations outside of the dragons: a centaur-like race that worshipped Zurvan, a rationalist society of multiple races that worshipped Sophia, and a race of tree people that didn't actually seem to worship anything until pushed to the grindstone by the Allagans and forced to summon Sephirot in self-defense.
-Allag failed to conquer it the first time, and had to come back centuries later with supertech to even have a chance
-In the present day, it's reported to be a wasteland... by sailors that can't even make landfall because of hostile locals, so what do they know?
-Thanks to Fandaniel, we did learn there was still a clan of dragons out there, and Tiamat's gone out to meet them. We can reasonably assume that the Warring Triad society's successors likely still exist too, five thousand years removed.
-Other scattered little pieces of info suggest Australian fauna, i.e. kangaroos. There's also some hints of Africa with stuff like the sphinxes in Azys Lla.

Just because you look at this and only think of the dragons, doesn't mean that the dragons are all we've got. Meracydia's actually roughly comparable to what we had of Tural pre-Dawntrail; with Tural we had the Mamool Ja, the Whalaqee, and that's about it, and they went off and made my favorite expansion out of that mystery zone. With Meracydia, we have one dragon, the vague specter of the Warring Triad's societies, and the overall vibe of 'Australia'; that's a hell of a lot of blank space to fill in.

I look at Meracydia and see a hell of a lot of potential for a story: not only do we have Tiamat as an exceptionally odd contact there, but the fact that the locals are so hostile raises interesting questions about how we handle in an adventure there; are the locals so desperate to handle a problem that they ask for outside help despite their own sensibilities, or are they so hostile that we have to prove ourselves to be cool to an entire goddamn Australia? Are they hostile out of general distrust of outsiders, or are they actually trying to protect something? Did Allag get knocked back the first time because Allag just sucked at naval warfare, or did they have a great secret that still lies there? And what about all the cool Australia stuff that's there? We saw Dawntrail make great stuff out of the Yucatan cenotes, the painted hills, and even a Texan desert, let's see what they can do with stuff like Uluru, or the Great Barrier Reef!

Also, forgive me, but I wanna see one of my favorite games do their version of my home country. I wanna see Meracydia in the same way I wanna see Pokemon do an Australian region, and I'm a lot more interested in that than 'let's go to the Fourth to commit cannibalism'.

Originally Posted by Chasingstars

And that is the point, explore the subject matter, where maybe there is a person who doesn't want to be rejoined to have their autonomy taken. That is a goldmine for storytelling. Not engaging with that content, by contrast, is just leaving a plot thread dangling for no other reason and could be considered wasted potential in writing. After all, if goes unexplored, then why was it even brought up in the storyline? Sure it tells us we are an incomplete version of Azem, but if we do nothing with that storyline, then I could snip it out of the story and no harm comes to the story. See what I mean?

I'm sure that other Azem shards will appear in the future and that there is a reason why they were introduced to the story. But there's a lot that can happen with these characters apart from rejoining with us. They aren't objects to be picked up and used, like the crystals of light we collected in ARR.
As long as the story hasn't established that we need to absorb other Azem shards, there is no need to do it, not to mention that the WoL would never agree to it without good reason.

Just because something would be interesting in a story doesn't mean it should happen, especially if it doesn't make sense for it to happen.
I could see a villainous Azem-shard trying it though.

Originally Posted by Thighland

I'm sure that other Azem shards will appear in the future and that there is a reason why they were introduced to the story. But there's a lot that can happen with these characters apart from rejoining with us. They aren't objects to be picked up and used, like the crystals of light we collected in ARR.

There's also a lot that can be done with shards when not actually touching the subject of 'BUT WHAT ABOUT AZEM'. After all, we've hit both the Thirteenth and the Ninth without hearing a peep about it, and I wouldn't say either story was in any way begging for their presence.

And before anyone tries to say that it was Golbez, Zero, or Also Golbez: we actually know who the Thirteenth shard of Azem is most likely to be, and it's also the clearest evidence why we won't be going off and eating Azem shards as a long-term goal.

It's the Reaper's Avatar, as per the EE3. Can't exactly go eating them for power (because for some reason that's desirable to people) without ruining Reaper's whole deal.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by ShadowyZero

if there is still a civilization left in Meracydia then its likely not having a good time with the hostile environment an likely under constant threat of the remnants of Allag i.e. war machines and soulless clones. though with Tiamat making her return there maybe that will somehow better things in some way but even if the triad returns it wont matter cause we have cured tempering an even found a repellent towards it.

I would actually say that any theorizing about Meracydia should completely put aside 'they fought Allag' as a significant detail to their current presence, because people seem to reflexively over-focus on it, probably because it's the biggest thing we know. But Allag was five thousand years ago; acting like Meracydia's still defined by fighting Allag is like assuming that modern-day Egypt must have a primarily pyramid-centric society; reasonably, Allag's not that big a deal for them.

I think that, if Allag must be some kind of bedrock component for a Meracydian story, that we might see something like Home from FFX: that a society off in a vast desert (because it is Fantasy Australia; we're not just desert, but we do have a lot of it) has taken up those weapons, appropriated it, and made it their own.

i hear you about the people excited about Mercydia but i think we know too much about it as is, which is why it confused me when Hades brought it up because like what more is there for us to possibly know that hasn't already been revealed or is common knowledge at this point? how would they translate it all into a compelling narrative thats supposed to span across an entire expansion?
like i tell you what we all know about Mercydia if that will help my argument here but to give you the cliff notes version it boils down too: "people really hated the Allagan Empire so they joined hands with the Dragons to fight them"
but here is the lengthier part of what we all known about Mercydia:

We have to first go all the way back to Midgardsomr an how he fled his star cause it was under threat of invasion by the omnicron he took his eggs after having bested Omega in combat and fled too Eitherys which at the time was described as hovering in some kind of space-time bubble which Midgardsomr dived into traversing what we know as the inter dimensional rift an settling himself into the refection with the most aether concentration "The Source"
and its here he was confronted by Hydaelyn who granted him stay if he did one small favor for her an that was to guard the gateway into the aetherial plane to which he agreed too an was even given the ability to consume aether to prolong his life after death.
moving forward his children hatched an were taught about the lands of Eitherys and its people and then when they matured they all flew to the corners of the world.
Niddhogg, Ratatoskr, and Hrysvalgr went north and settled in the Dravanian hinterlands an abalathia's spine. Vtra and his sister Azdaja went east an settled in thavnir tropics, then Bahamut and Tiamat eloped an settled south in the continent of Meracydia

Bahamut and Tiamat were viewed as god like they were the figure heads of Meracydia and were the island's protectors/gaurdians we know there were beastkin there the tree like people are one example and the lizard-chimera are the other both sentient an intelligent races of people then later came hyuran an others who were fleeing from the oppression of Allag they sought refuge in Meracydia an Bahamut granted it too them they co-existed in peace but as we knew Omega had pursued Midgardsomr an crashed landed near cartineu flats where the Allagan's found it an brought it back to normal function an even found a way to control it remotely they began to push into the southern continent an this prompted the people to act they begged for Bahamut to be their shield and champion and he did he successfully repelled the Allagan's but they wouldn't give up so easily an thats when Amon orders them to release Omega an it defeated Bahamut crushing all of Meracydia's hopes this as we know of course was all by Ascian design they wanted to create this conflict in hopes of triggering a rejoining event so they approached the grief stricken Tiamat an the people of Meracydia an taught them the art of Summoning to call forth their own gods an this how the elder eikons were born in the forms of "The Warring Triad" and Bahamut Prime.
but this only threw the nation into chaos an the lyrics of Sophia's theme song tell us the tale of blood being spilled in order to maintain order an force away the Allagan Empire but this too failed the Allagan's were just far too advanced for their magic Omega defeated them all and captured them an they were then used for ghastly and inhumane experiments and a local beast known as "ixalion" was used to summon Garuda an later fused with more hyuran like genetics to become what we know as the ixal.
Tiamat cried out for help from her siblings however after witnessing the fall of Bahamut a second time an her sister Azdaja answered her cry an flew to her aid along with Vitra. they two attacked Azy Lla creating destruction and chaos but the Allagan's employed voidsent which we know the pair of great wyrms had already been fighting before on their own home island in thavnir. Azdaja put of fierce resistance but eventually fell into a trap an ends up going to the Void a distraught Vitra then is unable to continue fighting an he flees back to thavnir an Tiamat is recaptured an binded in Azy Lla but their attack did have one effect in their favor an thats that it created a window for the goddess eikon Sophia who used that opportunity to wake up Bahamut an this is what causes a calamity and sinks the Crystal Tower.

So with all this in mind i struggle to see how they could create a solid enough or compelling enough story line when so much is already known an the premise is just going to devolve into either Allagan shenanigans or Ascian's Fault for the situation all over again.. this why i thing Meracydia would probably be better off as a stand alone main quest rather than a whole Expansion worth of content cause its gunna feel like a Heavensward all over again an i dont think people want that.