@Casuals , do you think the message has gotten through?

[Volgia]

Shame on my fellow Savage raiders in this thread making people challenged by MSQ dungeons, normal raids, or alliance raids feel bad.

One guy was rude and called people NPCs, most of us were just saying that a large portion of the game is focused for casual people. If you are being challenged by MSQ dungeons, alliance raids and normal raids then you're not starving for content.

My fellow Savage raiders need to learn to stay in our lane. That content is not meant to challenge us. It challenges the players that it's meant to challenge.

I disagree, you don't need everything to be Savage or Ultimate difficulty to challenge players. Strayborough's first boss didnt have super hard mechs or dps checks and it was an okay challenge for an end-game dungeon.

[0blivion]

I backread and saw someone unironically call Unreal "higher difficulty". That shows me how screwed this thread is. If you can't handle DT dungeon design (still very free and easy), that is a you problem. Same for raids. "But muh sub" - FFXV had several people give up too because they sucked at the game. So did some of the people dying on the infamously bad bossfight in KH1. They paid for those games, but they can't be expected to get coddled at the expense of literally everyone else.

[Mawlzy]

I backread and saw someone unironically call Unreal "higher difficulty". That shows me how screwed this thread is. If you can't handle DT dungeon design (still very free and easy), that is a you problem. Same for raids. "But muh sub" - FFXV had several people give up too because they sucked at the game. So did some of the people dying on the infamously bad bossfight in KH1. They paid for those games, but they can't be expected to get coddled at the expense of literally everyone else.

You have made the enlightened suggestion before that a story/easy mode would solve the fact that us dummies struggle in MSQ content without anything occurring "at the expense of everyone else."

I don't need stuff like Strayborough made easier, I'm not going to waste my time with it.

[Carin-Eri]

I backread and saw someone unironically call Unreal "higher difficulty". That shows me how screwed this thread is. If you can't handle DT dungeon design (still very free and easy), that is a you problem. Same for raids. "But muh sub" - FFXV had several people give up too because they sucked at the game. So did some of the people dying on the infamously bad bossfight in KH1. They paid for those games, but they can't be expected to get coddled at the expense of literally everyone else.

I'm going to quote an older Mawlzy reply in response to this, as they said it better than I could:

The fact you find that dungeons are currently at a happy medium tells us nothing beyond the fact they are ideally tuned for your skill level. Definitionally, a happy medium means unhappy players at the poles of the skill spread.

But I'll play along. If we do not need an easy mode, do we need a hard mode to keep the strong players entertained? Because many of them continually whine about the braindead content and the "outright stupidity" of those with whom they must run the dungeons.

[Valence]

Shame on my fellow Savage raiders in this thread making people challenged by MSQ dungeons, normal raids, or alliance raids feel bad. There are plenty of people who struggle with mechanics in these places. I know. I play a healer. I see them get clipped or run right into an AoE or what have you all the time. I don't come here whining that they get clipped. I heal them because that's my job. I pick them up off the floor because that's my job. In 11 years of healing, I can name on a single hand the number of times where it was obvious someone just wanted to be carried. All the other times I could see people truly trying.

I was so angry when I had a new person in M5N who was dying a lot because they were NEW and they apologized for being a burden and said we could kick them because they kept messing up. We all assured them that it was not a problem and we wanted them there. But shame on many of you in this thread. You're where that mentality is coming from. You're the ones making them feel like a burden and like they aren't wanted. I don't want them in my Savage parties but they're not in my Savage parties. They're in the content that is made for them to enjoy. I want them to feel welcome even if they are less than perfect. Because they're doing content where it doesn't matter if they are. We can cover and muddle our way through.

My fellow Savage raiders need to learn to stay in our lane. That content is not meant to challenge us. It challenges the players that it's meant to challenge. We are doing the content that's meant to challenge us. We shouldn't be making people feel bad or like they're a burden when they're doing the content meant to challenge them.

Amen to that

Strayborough's first boss didnt have super hard mechs or dps checks and it was an okay challenge for an end-game dungeon.

This dungeon, and especially the first boss, is literally the first time in my whole 10 years of XIV history I have seen people consistently complaining about it WITHIN the dungeon itself. At least half of my runs had someone getting pissed by this boss specifically.

As someone who's raided for a long time, I absolutely loathe luigi's mansion. It just sucks.

[Uzephi]

Sorry but if you want to do everything "SOLO" you may be in the wrong game, its a MMORPG if you dont like social interactions or to play with others its clearly not for you

I find it funny you think I am implying I don't want social interactions or even want to attempt that content solo. That isn't the case. I'm forced to do it solo because no 'casual' buddies of mine will stick through two bad sessions. After 15hrs invested, and little reward and still two floor sets away from the prize really demotivates quite a few people, sadly. The issue isn't about the social aspect, it's finding others dedicated enough to actually tackle the challenge floors and 'progress' through them, which means you might not clear it the first few times, so buckle up and get ready to spend 30hra of your life learning floor 181-200 of potd since one wipe means restarting from the start (or 51 if you choose to skip 5 of the 20 duties this challenge has)

Imagine a savage raid, but you 'need' to stick with the same people the whole time to keep your prog points, replace one person is a huge liability in the higher floors if the new recruit isn't in sync with your group or didn't study that cone of the mammoth isn't a cone but a 180 cleave and wipes your party.

[AvoSturmfaust]

I find it funny you think I am implying I don't want social interactions or even want to attempt that content solo. That isn't the case. I'm forced to do it solo because no 'casual' buddies of mine will stick through two bad sessions. After 15hrs invested, and little reward and still two floor sets away from the prize really demotivates quite a few people, sadly. The issue isn't about the social aspect, it's finding others dedicated enough to actually tackle the challenge floors and 'progress' through them, which means you might not clear it the first few times, so buckle up and get ready to spend 30hra of your life learning floor 181-200 of potd since one wipe means restarting from the start (or 51 if you choose to skip 5 of the 20 duties this challenge has)

Imagine a savage raid, but you 'need' to stick with the same people the whole time to keep your prog points, replace one person is a huge liability in the higher floors if the new recruit isn't in sync with your group or didn't study that cone of the mammoth isn't a cone but a 180 cleave and wipes your party.

Then i misunderstood it, im sorry, it sounded for me like you didnt want any social interaction and want to solo everything, my bad

[Uzephi]

Then i misunderstood it, im sorry, it sounded for me like you didnt want any social interaction and want to solo everything, my bad

No worries, it's content most don't touch, and the' story' floors are mainly what most of the player base actually does. It's quite difficult to find people who understand the lethality of the higher floors who actually will do them with you, for the points I have said in this thread.

Not many 'casuals' will have the dedication to learning those higher floors, even some raiders in my FC won't touch DDs because of how easy the first 60% of the floors are. You don't even need a tank (or kite if a DPS running solo) until floor 151 (potd) or floor 61 (HoH/EO), so quite a few players feel the rest of the floors are as easy as the story floors, or just slightly harder. So, when your party wipes on a mob that starts two shotting your DPS and healer, the group falls apart because they were led to believe this content was 'easy' only to get smacked around on the final two floor sets because everybody underestimates 'challenge floors.'

[Volgia]

Amen to that



This dungeon, and especially the first boss, is literally the first time in my whole 10 years of XIV history I have seen people consistently complaining about it WITHIN the dungeon itself. At least half of my runs had someone getting pissed by this boss specifically.

As someone who's raided for a long time, I absolutely loathe luigi's mansion. It just sucks.

It made me think Dawntrail was gonna get more creative with it's boss designs on expert dungeons, but people endlessly and angrily complained about it, so here we have our dull target dummies instead.

[Valence]

It made me think Dawntrail was gonna get more creative with it's boss designs on expert dungeons, but people endlessly and angrily complained about it, so here we have our dull target dummies instead.

And I'll resign to my dull target dummies if we can't get anything better.