Proposal: Rebalance FFXIV Around Living Zones and Scalable Challenge

[Mawlzy]

I cant Remember one single game in the past 18 Years where no hard content or "challening content" was the main thing for endgame, be it like i said raids or dungeons or some solo stuff or anything


But thats not the topic here, it shouldnt be go in this direction again, i was just curious why people play a MMORPG when they not really participate in 70% of the Content

I've always regarded "endgame" as an artificial construct. Sure each expansion has its most difficult PvE, but so what? MMORPGs offer a lot more than that. Naturally raiders view on-cycle EX+ as "endgame," but most players ignore it, demonstrating it's not some culmination of the content at all; simply optional content for those that enjoy it.

It's hard to estimate how much time I've spent in raids/trials/dungeons, but on cycle it's the bare minimum. I do the required MSQ dungeons and trials once. I don't need to grind for tomes because I don't need BiS for anything. In terms of time-on-task, I doubt I've spent more than 2% of my time on such content.

Theme park MMOs perpetuate this endgame myth, in part in a desperate attempt to make gearing up or skill trees remain relevant, while the other wing of the genre - sandbox MMOs - have always completely ignored it.

[Altina_Orion]

I've always regarded "endgame" as an artificial construct. Sure each expansion has its most difficult PvE, but so what? MMORPGs offer a lot more than that. Naturally raiders view on-cycle EX+ as "endgame," but most players ignore it, demonstrating it's not some culmination of the content at all; simply optional content for those that enjoy it.

It's hard to estimate how much time I've spent in raids/trials/dungeons, but on cycle it's the bare minimum. I do the required MSQ dungeons and trials once. I don't need to grind for tomes because I don't need BiS for anything. In terms of time-on-task, I doubt I've spent more than 2% of my time on such content.

Theme park MMOs perpetuate this endgame myth, in part in a desperate attempt to make gearing up or skill trees remain relevant, while the other wing of the genre - sandbox MMOs - have always completely ignored it.

This isn't a sandbox MMO though... and also, what do you do if you don't mind me asking? It seems to me from what you typed that you don't engage in ANY content?

Also, I can't think of a single sandbox MMO that is even remotely successful in comparison to the big ones. OSRS is sandbox-ish but it's not truly a sandbox MMO.

[Mawlzy]

This isn't a sandbox MMO though... and also, what do you do if you don't mind me asking? It seems to me from what you typed that you don't engage in ANY content?

Also, I can't think of a single sandbox MMO that is even remotely successful in comparison to the big ones. OSRS is sandbox-ish but it's not truly a sandbox MMO.

Yes, I'm aware this isn't a sandbox, that's why I made the distinction. But the amount of required PvE is minimal, so to elevate raids and trials to "The Endgame" above everything else simply reflects the preferences of the person making that proclamation.

One could equally well claim that grinding scrips to give your crafters and gatherers BiS, plus the books and wotnot to even open up the highest crafts and gathers, is also endgame.

What about PvP? I have around 10,000 Frontline matches. The current iteration is, by definition, the endgame version of Frontline. It underwent significant changes in 7.1 and 7.2. Can that not be called endgame?

For me, MSQ PvE is an obstacle I need to overcome to continue the story and open up all the gathering zones. There is a significant fraction of the player base that feels the same. The idea that the optional PvE is some Holy Grail is foreign to me. It's simply there for the minority that enjoy it.

[Valence]

Actually yes, give me one MMORPG which isnt based on challening endgamecontent

All of them? Most seem to have a mix of challenging and normal content.

[Mawlzy]

Actually yes, give me one MMORPG which isnt based on challening endgamecontent

All of them? Most seem to have a mix of challenging and normal content.

This is, of course, correct.

I've been happily (mostly) been playing MMOs for a couple of decades and never engaged with whatever the community had labeled "challenging endgame content." The concept comes from single-player games, where the goal is to "beat the game."

You cannot beat an MMO.