Please Stop Genderlocking Gear

[Batbrat]

They did not wear a ladies fine sunday dress... its not about normal skirts and all...

And it's not about your feelings at all either, but here we are.

Anyway, so we know that the argument for removing the genderlock entirely would be that in doing so, that would provide players with even more options for their video game characters glams.
Now, what is the actual argument against that?
Why should they NOT remove the genderlock from glams?
Why should players have less to choose from, why is more variety a bad idea?

Can you or anyone else give a straight forward on-topic answer that does not have any feelings, personal politics, or unconfirmable speculation?

[EdenElsewhere]

Let's just cut through all the crap right now:

"This does not look good on men", or "Men should be masculine", are not actual reasons to to keep men from wearing the stockings with garter belts.

Nor is "What if teens playing this game see this" because that is a parent's job, not the goddamn world's (plus your teen has already likely seen worse by now). It is a parents job to determine what their kid sees when they turn on their computer.

There is not a single argument for why men should not have gotten the stockings (not even the actually rather decent "What about the game's own personal choice of aesthetics?" because men already have a few pairs of stockings.) and I have yet to see any actually decent argument proposed in favor of keeping the stockings genderlocked/varianted.

Reasons for why they should not do the gender lock/variant are better though:
1. Less dev work as a whole (if we presume they don't have just a slacks generator at this point)
2. Keeping customer trust (these were stockings in the photo on the live letter. They were on the female model, however, that is my first impression, which means I was expecting stockings)
3. Less moderator work as a whole (less of these threads!)
4. More variance in glamours
5. ACTUALLY KEEPING IN LINE WITH THE FACT IT IS A COSPLAY GLAMOUR.
6. Making the people who wanted the stockings on their men happy, as very few (if any) people would have quit the game over stockings, and if they did, well, that's their own issue and they probably should have quit the game a long time back.

[SophiaDL]

Let's just cut through all the crap right now:

"This does not look good on men", or "Men should be masculine", are not actual reasons to to keep men from wearing the stockings with garter belts.

Nor is "What if teens playing this game see this" because that is a parent's job, not the goddamn world's (plus your teen has already likely seen worse by now). It is a parents job to determine what their kid sees when they turn on their computer.

There is not a single argument for why men should not have gotten the stockings (not even the actually rather decent "What about the game's own personal choice of aesthetics?" because men already have a few pairs of stockings.) and I have yet to see any actually decent argument proposed in favor of keeping the stockings genderlocked/varianted.

Reasons for why they should not do the gender lock/variant are better though:
1. Less dev work as a whole (if we presume they don't have just a slacks generator at this point)
2. Keeping customer trust (these were stockings in the photo on the live letter. They were on the female model, however, that is my first impression, which means I was expecting stockings)
3. Less moderator work as a whole (less of these threads!)
4. More variance in glamours
5. ACTUALLY KEEPING IN LINE WITH THE FACT IT IS A COSPLAY GLAMOUR.
6. Making the people who wanted the stockings on their men happy, as very few (if any) people would have quit the game over stockings, and if they did, well, that's their own issue and they probably should have quit the game a long time back.

All of this is literally your opinion, just like the people that have the opposite opinion

Also your points are completely moot

Less dev work as a whole (if we presume they don't have just a slacks generator at this point)

That makes no sense, its double to work to adapt to both genders and different looks of it

Keeping customer trust (these were stockings in the photo on the live letter. They were on the female model, however, that is my first impression, which means I was expecting stockings)

There's been a lot of things on live letters, even on expansion pictures that didnt happen, it never led to "massive community distrust"

3. Less moderator work as a whole (less of these threads!)

Will be replaced by literally any other topic, absolutely moot point

4. More variance in glamours

There's already a lot of variety, this wouldnt help much at all, if anything we should be requesting more glams in general, not just the gendered stuff.

5. ACTUALLY KEEPING IN LINE WITH THE FACT IT IS A COSPLAY GLAMOUR.

Literally doesnt matter.

6. Making the people who wanted the stockings on their men happy, as very few (if any) people would have quit the game over stockings, and if they did, well, that's their own issue and they probably should have quit the game a long time back.

Goes both ways. If you absolutely want tights for men, then just leave?

[EdenElsewhere]

All of this is literally your opinion, just like the people that have the opposite opinion

Um... no?

1. It is proven that they have to make separate leg pieces for lalafells when they do gender variants. They literally have to make two versions for one pair of legs. Even at the most basic level, they are making more work for themselves when they do gender variants.
2. Multiple people went into the Occult crescent expecting the Tycoon legs to be stockings as they are portrayed as stockings in the photo on the patch notes. The fact that these were not stockings on men, is a little bit disheartening.
3. You can't possibly expect for me to believe that if the opposite of this thread (oh why didn't they makes these slacks? guys have enough stockings!) would have reached 23 pages of actual discussion. No. it would have been laughed at for 5 straight pages before being left to die.
4. ... Men literally have no stockings with garterbelts available to them. You either have to fake garterbelts somehow (like using the faire joi with something like the caller sandals) or just have no garterbelts.
5. You can literally go look at Lenna. In Yoshitaka Amano's artwork she is either wearing stockings, or only her undies.
6. This one is more opinion, but honestly, if you wanna leave the game over stockings, very much a you issue.

[PyurBlue]

There's already a lot of variety, this wouldnt help much at all, if anything we should be requesting more glams in general, not just the gendered stuff.

There would be a lot more variety without locks. Saying that variety already exists doesn't change that. I also don't see how asking for unlocks is any different from asking for more glam. I want gear to be unlocked so I have more choices when making outfits. Items that I can't wear may as well not exist in my game because they have no use to me.

[Granyala]

and I have yet to see any actually decent argument proposed in favor of keeping the stockings genderlocked/varianted.

And I have yet to see any FACTUAL argument for why gear shouldn't be genderlocked if DEVs choose so.
All I see (and that is of course legitimate) "I and a few others want this, so this is right".

So lets just drop this ridiculous pretense of "I have arguments, you do not" and express that what we really want: a wish according to personal taste.

I am not against them unlocking the gear but I am also not sad when they do not do so.

5. You can literally go look at Lenna. In Yoshitaka Amano's artwork she is either wearing stockings, or only her undies.

SHE being the operative word here. So for all intents and purposes that would be accurate to the cosplay. Do you see males running around like it in the artwork? Then you'd have an objective argument.

[Evermomo]

SHE being the operative word here. So for all intents and purposes that would be accurate to the cosplay. Do you see males running around like it in the artwork? Then you'd have an objective argument.

They didn't change the other outfits to be more feminine on women, so they shouldn't have changed Lenna's outfit to be more masculine on men. There were three different options of varying masculine & feminine styles to choose from already. The idea "women should dress skimpily and men should dress modestly" is sexist, full stop.

I'm not against sexy glams or Amano's style, but if you make erotic gear and lock it to women, that's an objectification of women, personal taste be damned.

[Granyala]

if you make erotic gear and lock it to women, that's an objectification of women, personal taste be damned.

I agree though I do not think it would be any less objectifying going on of they made it sexy for both genders. Both would be equally objectified.
Apart from the fact that not every man finds this style of clothing "sexy" and I do not know of any women that would find the thing in question sexy on men. :'D

[Evermomo]

I agree though I do not think it would be any less objectifying going on of they made it sexy for both genders. Both would be equally objectified.
Apart from the fact that not every man finds this style of clothing "sexy" and I do not know of any women that would find the thing in question sexy on men. :'D

You know different women than I do. But that's what I mean-- gender alone doesn't predict preference. And if the tights are objectifying, then it's rude to give them to women in the first place.

But I don't agree that they are. Clothes on their own don't mistreat or degrade anybody, and it's possible to dress like Lenna, or design clothes like Lenna's, for fun and for expression. But since I believe that, I want everybody to have the equal opportunity to do so.

[EdenElsewhere]

And I have yet to see any FACTUAL argument for why gear shouldn't be genderlocked if DEVs choose so.
All I see (and that is of course legitimate) "I and a few others want this, so this is right".

So lets just drop this ridiculous pretense of "I have arguments, you do not" and express that what we really want: a wish according to personal taste.

I am not against them unlocking the gear but I am also not sad when they do not do so.

SHE being the operative word here. So for all intents and purposes that would be accurate to the cosplay. Do you see males running around like it in the artwork? Then you'd have an objective argument.

You would have an actual point if the other outfits weren't already a 1 to 1 recreation on both sexes.

or if there was any gender variation on any of the other outfits in the occult crescent. From my immediate knowledge, there isn't.