SE: How do I know if I am doing enough damage in Savage?

[Exmo]

I’m more specifically referring to beginner/casual players that don’t necessarily have the knowledge to diagnose the problem or to realize that they might be the ones doing something wrong in their rotations or uptime. I’ve had a session of dying a few times in M1S to enrage with only two or three deaths, in 7.1 where people had much better gear than they needed, and the people thought the problems were the two deaths and that was savage is just really really really hard. And then I noticed players not using any abilities at all during mechanics despite having spent multiple sessions trying to get the clear. I saw their characters spent a lot of time only running, or the party list rarely showed them casting offensive spells. Players who don’t know what to look for don’t really notice this stuff unless either someone else tells them or a a third party tool tells them.

I don’t disagree that this problem can be solved with some reflection about one’s own performance, as is the case for a lot of us that figure it out. But since I’ve seen people either get the answer wrong (eg. “I just need to gcd heal less,” “we need to never die so we can clear M1S”) or fail to even realize there’s a problem in how they’re playing (“savage is just really really hard,” “as a healer it’s not my fault we’re seeing enrage”) then I think ingame feedback of some kind would be good for new players.

Otherwise there will be people who either keep playing at a beginner level, or just give up, because they don’t know enough to identify and solve the problems. Even if it’s straightforward for those of us who already know the game.

Generally speaking I don't think beginners/casuals should dive straight into the latest raid tier. There's a natural progression between normal content, old extremes, old savages, new extremes, new savages. I'm not saying they need to have completed all old savage content before playing a new tier, but following that progression can help a lot with understanding what they're getting into and what's expected of them.

Regarding seeing enrage in m1s with only a couple deaths, I can't really comment without knowing more details like the boss' HP and the general party gear setup during the session. If we're taking about 1% at enrage, I wouldn't chase my party members over missed dps. If we're talking 15% it's time for the party as a whole to get reflective as to what's going wrong. At the end of the day, beginners won't magically stop being beginners because they're using a banned addon. It takes practice and patience and attention.

That all said, I don't think this thread is really talking about how a beginner might improve at savage, so I think we've gotten off topic.

[Kohashi]

Generally speaking I don't think beginners/casuals should dive straight into the latest raid tier. There's a natural progression between normal content, old extremes, old savages, new extremes, new savages. I'm not saying they need to have completed all old savage content before playing a new tier, but following that progression can help a lot with understanding what they're getting into and what's expected of them.

Regarding seeing enrage in m1s with only a couple deaths, I can't really comment without knowing more details like the boss' HP and the general party gear setup during the session. If we're taking about 1% at enrage, I wouldn't chase my party members over missed dps. If we're talking 15% it's time for the party as a whole to get reflective as to what's going wrong. At the end of the day, beginners won't magically stop being beginners because they're using a banned addon. It takes practice and patience and attention.

That all said, I don't think this thread is really talking about how a beginner might improve at savage, so I think we've gotten off topic.

I think the biggest difference between a beginner and a seasoned raider is not class proficiency but the mental fortitude they developed. The ability to deal with stressful situations and overcome roadblocks. Of course, knowledge and progression is useful but I think the grit/ mental fortitude plays a much more impactful role in raiding.