Tanks Help me out

[Rithy255]

Heart of Corundum and Aurora's heal output is pretty dang good. GNB might have better survivability than PLD if we don't count Clemency honestly. I've solo'd some dungeon bosses with it in the past too (with consent! I asked if I should try to keep going or wipe after everyone else died like 15% into the fight and it ended up so painfully long).

DRK's harder but some good usage of TBN, Abyssal Drain, Shadowed Vigil and Living Dead can manage it. The difference in healing needed for a DRK that knows its kit and one that doesn't is very, very noticeable.

I'd disagree that drks harder to wall to wall, Abyssal drain is very underated, that along with how much sheer mitigation you get now with the darkmind/missonary changes plus TBN being great with all your mits makes dark very good in dungeon AOE. Drk's slightly behind on single target sustain but not by a lot, makes up with its mitigation value by far.

[AmiableApkallu]

Hmm. I can see the problem better when dps perform well. Still not convinced majority of healers in df could keep up if tanks got their healing gutted. Tanks would need something in return for losing it

If I recall correctly, PLD gets all of their non-Clemency self-healing (self-HP restoration) after Lv.80, i.e., starting in Endwalker. I'm pretty sure healers have been keeping up with them just fine in all those Shadowbringers, Stormblood, etc. dungeons.

[Rithy255]

If I recall correctly, PLD gets all of their non-Clemency self-healing (self-HP restoration) after Lv.80, i.e., starting in Endwalker. I'm pretty sure healers have been keeping up with them just fine in all those Shadowbringers, Stormblood, etc. dungeons.

It's because people overvalue Self healing and don't realise the mitigation + self healing combo both being strong is why it feels too much, that with the lack of damage.

[Azurarok]

I'd disagree that drks harder to wall to wall, Abyssal drain is very underated, that along with how much sheer mitigation you get now with the darkmind/missonary changes plus TBN being great with all your mits makes dark very good in dungeon AOE. Drk's slightly behind on single target sustain but not by a lot, makes up with its mitigation value by far.

By that I meant more like you need to actually keep an eye on your hp and not throw it out on cooldown and/or space it out well with your other oGCDs. I think there's a little more room for error with GNB's Corundum and Aurora because of the way they both heal

[Derio]

It is possible but you need really good dps. And you cant do it on day 1 patch with the latest dungeons.

[Alice_Rivers]

It is possible but you need really good dps. And you cant do it on day 1 patch with the latest dungeons.

I'm not convinced, my pocket DRK did the new dungeon minimum ilvl because they spent the last five months crafting instead of gearing, I basically only had to step in because they refused to use living dead when they needed to.

[CKNovel]

The answer is that it depends.

Alone? You'll die.
With 2/3 good DPS? You'll kill the trash before they're even a danger.

The rhetoric that healers are useless is half true. In dungeon they exist to throw a party wide oGCD healing here and there and to res KO'd players.
Since trash pack damages are entirely focused on one target, 3/4 of the Healing kit is useless.

[Laerune]

As a healer, it depends on the skill of the player. That said, from personal experience 90% of wall to wall pulls with Dark Knight have always resulted in me using majority of my spells. With other jobs, I dps more than heal.

[Valence]

Reducing tanks’s ability to stay alive means now you need both your tank and healer in duty roulette to know how to play the game, which would be simultaneously a blessing and a curse. But it would cause problems with high end content that’s designed with these kits in mind, like it’s a big deal that we can press TBN/Bloodwhetting/Sheltron/Corundum as many times as we can in DSR phase 6 because it has five tankbusters. I think the devs have put themselves into a corner in this regard, and if they ever want normal difficulty content to ask more of tanks/healers then they’d have to increase its damage but they might not be able to take away tank abilities unless other things change (like by moving the ability to keep tanks alive more towards just being healers’ responsibility, which again is both a blessing and curse).

I hardly think it's a problem. Tanks can keep their mitigation on their defensives if it's about busters. They don't need all the bloated healing that comes with it. Even in savage/ultimate tanks can take care of themselves without a healer in 99% of the cases.

[Rithy255]

I hardly think it's a problem. Tanks can keep their mitigation on their defensives if it's about busters. They don't need all the bloated healing that comes with it. Even in savage/ultimate tanks can take care of themselves without a healer in 99% of the cases.

Problem is you go from not healing to the tank to healing them like once every minute because the mitigation, taking no damage from auto's is a big part into why tanks feel so invincible.

Sustain is only one part of the problem.