Please reduce tank healing power by a lot

[Arohk]

Why is it a dumb thing to say

Shake is literally the strongest healing CD of any class in the game for its usability/CD and its healing

From all the things you you could choose you pick the Party Mitigation, which no one even mentioned.

Every tank has this:

paladin has an instant heal + shield
warrior has a shield + hot
gunbreaker and dark knight have a 10%/5% damage reduction.

[PercibelTheren]

what a dumb thing to say...

Is it? Shake has a relatively beefy shield, which makes it a really, really useful mit. It takes the pressure off healers in nasty situations and can help you pull through if a healer is dead during raidwides. That's its primary use in Extreme/Savage.

[AnjouMaaka]

Hard disagree. Anyone who works hard all day wants to come home and have a relaxing dungeon experience when they do their roulettes. Tanks being able to solo bosses when things go wrong keeps that in the realm of reality. This post hard caters to the players that live on this game 24/7/365 and pay for their sub through streaming it 24/7/365. You already got ultimate raids, but clearly that isn't enough for you.

[Azurarok]

Maybe Warrior should recover hp based on damage taken more since the idea seems to be its hp wildly fluctuates throughout a fight? Macrocosmos exists so it's not an entirely foreign concept at least.

Problem would be that they can't design tankbusters to do enough damage to one-shot tanks if that were the only tool it had though. Same issue WHM suffers, really. Can't heal hp back up if they're dead.

[bundythenoob]

I do agree that the tanks' sustain kits are pretty bloated, but I would rather see the devs tune encounter damage output so that our sustain is worth keeping around, than removing the sustain entirely and leaving damage instances too low for it to matter

[Rithy255]

I do agree that the tanks' sustain kits are pretty bloated, but I would rather see the devs tune encounter damage output so that our sustain is worth keeping around, than removing the sustain entirely and leaving damage instances too low for it to matter

This would be great but even then theirs pretty massive imbalances with how much more warrior has compared to other tanks, if you make sustaining more important that leaves warrior clearly better then other tanks defensively (I mean it already is with holm gang being 240s).


I just don't know how much damage we're ideally expecting fights to output if we consider sustain kits like warriors.

[AlliciaCapulet]

I just don't know how much damage we're ideally expecting fights to output if we consider sustain kits like warriors.

I'd say finding back the balance they had for normal content back in ARR/HW. Back then, a normal dungeon was taking around 25-30 minutes (instead of 8-10 minutes) and wipe were possible. Tanks were not able to solo a dungeon, healers were needed and the damage output was great enough that even the DPS needed to be healed. Also, when there was ads or other mecanics to do, the DPS had to leave the boss to actually do them.

Now normal content is just too easy, boring, and tanks can solo them. I know that it's the players that were once complaining that it was too hard, but the difficulty of the normal content doesn't have to be something that an handicaped drunk monkey can achieve...

Yes, I know, savage and ultimate exists (even if they are cleared without healers often), but honnestly the game lack stress right now, it's like too easy for 95% of the stuff that we can do...

At least, maybe they can keep the super easy level with the AI if you don't want to queue with people, so you have an easy mode, but when it's with players... the damage output of a fight and HP of monsters should increase too..

[Carighan]

I think some debloating is in order, but less in regards to "total power level" (that has to be done via encounter design, seriously) but more in well, raw bloat.

For sake of individually feeling powerful, tanks should probably one "rotational" defensive tool (something like a Paladin's frequent self-healing on abilities or Gunbreaker shielding themselves), one short-CD and one long-CD. No more 3 long CDs, instead of one really powerful one. Rampart is what we start with as a role action, each tank gets a trait to upgrade it into something better, and make them diverge more wildly. Short CDs could also be more more distinct, with different CD and effects (TBN already is a bit different from the other 3, but there's more room to play with there).

This in turn would then allow to tune encounters better: If we can't CD 4+ things in a row easily, and have this variability between stacking CDs vs chaining them, encounter damage can be tuned more precisely.

If I had a wish-list for re-implementing things, I'd do:

* Paladin: Support tank. Various ways to help others, which in turn lowers own CDs. Longest CDs by default, shortest or second-shortest in a group. Passively regenerates 10% of all damage taken back over the next 6 seconds. Support baked into the core kit, like spending instant spell + mana on Clemency should be preferred whenever someone else has damage over nuking with it, taking damage for someone else increases own damage output, that kind of stuff.
* Warrior: Sponge tank. Dealing damage passively stacks shields on self. Damage taken passively decreases the lower health is, in return for lower base damage reduction than other tanks. More HP, but from full health suffers more damage than others. CDs regenerate health and increase max-health further, but only decrease damage by quite little.
* Gunbreaker: Technical tank. All abilities have 25y range and a second animation if used that way. Various abilities move backwards by 5-10y, allow a single ranged attack, but for one GCD the enemy won't follow yet (this would be basically Continuation v2.0). Cartridges built in melee, expended while at range, granting non-stacking shields. CDs focus on automatic effects.
* Dark Knight: Drain tank. Direct damage reduced significantly, however most attacks apply stacking DoTs and all DoT damage heals the Dark Knight. Invuln fires automatically, no player input needed or even possible. Shortest CDs otherwise, but skills need to be timed well to be effective compared to the other tanks.

Anyhow the underlying point would be: less buttons, in return more meaningful differences. Some can be offloaded into passive things which is still good so long as the effects are significant enough to be constantly noticable!

[Oizen]

WAR could have Bloodwhetting reduced to per cast rather than per target, then throw 10% mit somewhere else in its kit (or new button) and it be a massive buff to the job imo

[Derio]

DRK barely has sustain. Please dont listen to OP and nerf DRK sustain.