We need to do something about Tanks and Outgoing Damage from Bosses

[Supersnow845]

it's normal mode, idc if tank want to clear on them own when a whole party is dead, i just alt tab and watching netflix, ripe my reward when i come back, if they expect i will hang around and watch how awesome they are, they are just delusion, it's hard working and no reward at all

come to me again when tank can solo clear hard content like savage, that's a real problem

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/s/4omx5rL23w

[ShariusTC]

https://www.reddit.com/r/ffxiv/s/4omx5rL23w

yeah, like try hard one with mandatory voice chat in discord, i am not in statis and go ahead and make all tank clear savage in pf to see how long you have to wait

there are big different with people that pursuit archivement and normies, like everyone know charge blade has lowest time for speedrun in monster hunter but vast majority of MH comunity doesn't use charge blade at all

[Supersnow845]

This is what causes this sliding scale

If we waited till the point where tank only or solo tank clears were so common as to be the norm in PF then there would a large chunk of the population who sees that as some sort of “identity” associated with the tanks and wouldn’t want it changed

We’ve seen this with the sustain. WAR in ShB was powerful on sustain but at least required some skill to pull it off, the deflection against nerfing at that point was “Tommy no thumbs drooling on his keyboard couldn’t do it”, so it became part of WAR’s identity, then BW was made available for Tommy no thumbs and the argument became “it’s only casual content”, at that point effortless self healing became an Omni tank identity and now you see this thread full of people associating it as some sort of tank identity. Endless backlash to calls to nerf BW also show this

So what happens when high end tank clears become even more common? (which they are only not very common because there is no incentive to do them, they aren’t particularly hard, I’ve cleared many on patch extremes in Omni tank parties) does only tank clears of savage become part of the tank identity as well

At what point is the “tank identity” “shut up and let me play the game for you”

[ShariusTC]

idk what your predict come from, up to last xpac people still wait their ass off in PF for healer to come to their party so they can farm high end content

[Asako]

Just don't die then. Tank isn't let me play the game for you. Tank is I have high HP and can take the bosses hits so you don't have to yet somehow with all the tools available to you to keep you alive you still manage to wipe. You used to be a healer main but you wont even do that now because of your childishness. Would you honest to God stop your absolute crying on this forum. You are without a doubt the biggest child I've ever seen perpetutually living on a forum. Years and years of just absolute wet talk complaining about something and never happy, never anything useful or interesting to say. Do you actually play the game or just live on the forums crying? What is it? Maybe FF14 isn't the game for you. Have you looked into other games? It's so embarrassing to constantly see your pathetic takes on this forum. Absolute whining machine. Just play Tank yourself. Have some fun, be invincible and see how far you get.

Warrior has been self sustaining like an absolute champion since ARR. It is literally the Warriors Identity to be a self healing machine. Stop trying to act like it's something new that they added just because they got Bloodwhetting and Flash. You have absolutely no idea of what you are talking about and are just salty that you die in content designed for single digit IQ players. It's never your fault. It's the Tank, like the Tank is some sort of boogie man out to ruin your fun.

At the end of the day, the game is as it is because people like you cannot do harder content, they cannot make bosses hit harder because you couldn't heal it when it did hit harder. The game was nerfed so badly and still, you manage to wipe constantly to nothing and come and play the blame game. Tanks were made stronger because someone has to carry you over the line as you are incapable of walking the shortest of distances. DPS and Healers have so much mitigation now there is honestly no excuse outside of being a new player to fail as badly as you apparantely do. It's level 100 content, you've had enough time with training wheels. Take them off and play the game. Put your tissues away.

[Supersnow845]

snip.

“Loses their shit I called them honey once proceeds to go on a 3 paragraph rant about how I’m the worst person on the forums”

Sweetie if you hate me so much then block me. I genuinely don’t care about your opinion of me. Because every post you’ve made in this thread is just black and white in the worst possible way. I play tank, I rarely die on the other roles and if I do when it’s my fault I fully acknowledge it’s my fault, however when I die when it’s not my fault and the tank choose to solo the boss when I don’t have a say then yeah that’s annoying. If I was the tank in that position then I would wipe……..because I like to consider whether other people are having fun when I play an MMO just as If I feel I overcommitted to my prog point I drop rather than cling on as a burden. I don’t see why the consideration of others time and enjoyment of a game is such a foreign concept to you. I’ve pointed out time and time again that the changes to the tank role that supposedly saved the game from collapsing just instead made healers the new tanks, I’m back to waiting 30 minutes for DPS queues in prime time aether. That’s HW post data centre DF queue times. If these tank changes saved the queues when are we going to save healer queues

I’m not the person who these simplification changes are directed towards, given you apparently read all my terrible feedback you’d know I support retention of complexity. I did (I got bored) savage and ultimate. I don’t see difference in player skill as an excuse to derive players in casual content from enjoyment because I think I’m more talented than them ESPECIALLY when there is no talent involved, it’s HP and defensive bloat. Don’t tell me you’ve never been clipped by an AOE as a tank and gone “whoopsie I would have died if I was a caster” because you know you have. I don’t think it’s proper design to go “whoopsie well I’m a tank, better carry on without everyone” because once again I care about the enjoyment other people have in this game and I like to think other people should care about the enjoyment I have, does that make me bleeding heart loser, probably. Do I care? Not really

If you wanna think I’m married to the forums, a serial complainer then sure, go ahead. I maintain a healthy balance with 14, other games and my wider life, I simply have a job that affords me a lot of free time and I like discussing a game I enjoy with other people. If you hate the feedback I offer then block me, like I said I don’t really care what you think of me

[Asako]

I didn't lose my shit at all. I just pointed out that it was childish because for some reason you needed something to prop yourself up, which nice of you to do once again. Really makes you look like a clown. Absolutely brilliant. You say you don't live on the forums yet have almost 6000 posts in 4 years. Catch a grip our fella. This isn't about hating you or your feedback, it's just embarrassing watching someone who hasn't a clue complain about something that happens once in a blue moon and yet still have the worst takes possible. Tanks are fine and they are staying the way they are, just as they have been since ARR. Why would they change now?

If you don't like the way the game is played then by all means use your own party finder to ensure there are no boogie man tanks out to steal your fun. Demanding players to kill themselves because you died is pathetic. If a Tank wants to wipe for you be thankful, but they are under absolutely no obligation to do so.

I have many times been clipped by an aoe and died and my response is quite simple. I messed up, I'll wait for a rez when they are ready not whine and demand that they all wipe for me. If I died because we died to unavoidable damage then it is what it is. Just enjoy the show. Tab out take a break and rewatch a clip to see what went wrong.

The 30 minute queues for a prime time pop tells me your on a dead server and the healers aren't the issue or once again you are telling porkies, and let's be frank, I'm well aware of which it is.

What is it you want for healers that would make them more popular. They can't get more damage spells, they had those, and they were removed because people couldn't use them. They can't really get more healing or mitigation as they have more than enough currently to survive most content without even the use of their GCD skills. They can't make bosses hit harder because the community simply isn't good enough to heal them in regualr content.

I'm still waiting for this magical idea that is going to solve everything for healers that hasn't been done already. The old FF you loved is gone. This is the new FF14. It's not going anywhere for a while so buckle up or blow town.

[Supersnow845]

“Tanks are fine just as they have been since ARR”

My brother in Christ your entire point is built on the fact that the tanks very much weren’t fine in ARR and they exist in the form they do now because they weren’t fine in ARR

You don’t even have a sense of internal logic to your points. The entire game will apparently collapse if HW is even mentioned yet at the same time when it’s needed they were always fine because healers weren’t fine and that’s why they are garbage

[hydralus]

Just don't die then.

Deal. Give DPS a native 60% damage reduction and ridiculous self-healing and I can survive with 6 vuln stacks same as any tank.

[Kaurhz]

It's a lot more challenging to die as a tank when you have an insane innate defense bonus to wherein anything that can give a vuln stack just tickles at best.

Besides, frankly speaking a lot of deaths that happen to DPS and Healer can very easily be avoided by tanks also using more of their defensive kit, e.g., Shake it Off, and Nascent Flash, especially post-healer death. It's so funny seeing a tank and a DPS have to solo for 70-80% of the fight, just for the tank to literally sit there and do nothing but sandbag the boss whilst the DPS is slowly whittled down by raid wide and other unavoidable AoEs, with said tank also doing absolutely nothing to contribute towards keeping other people alive.

Just for said tanks to get a little ego trip because they were the only one alive, and solo'd 50-70% of the boss because they essentially let everyone else -- Who knew what they were doing, slowly pop the casket to unavoidable damage. Whilst then also parading around with this "JuSt DoN'T dIe".

Edit : You aren't a god amongst men, you're someone with an insane defensive bonus coupled with the fact boss damage is woefully under-tuned to actually do anything through that innate defense that is afforded to tanks, and in many cases you're also neglecting half of your own defensive kit that can actually help other players survive even if/when the healer does get trounced.