No, we do have enough content

[Jojoya]

Most MMO players just want a reasonable experience for their money. I don't want to quit. I want the game to be decent.

You're not going to get the player base to agree on what constitutes decent. The members of my Free Company don't even agree about the state of the game. A few of us are stepping away from the game pending changes that may make it enjoyable to us again. Others are happy with it as is and continue to log in to play as usual.

Who do you think SE is more likely to listen to?

Continuing to pay for game time isn't going to cause the game to change to your satisfaction when other players are satisfied with how it currently is.

In the long run, it's your money. You can keep spending on something you don't feel is decent, or you can spend it elsewhere on something that does.

Just remember that by continuing to pay for a product you don't like, you're enabling the business to continue turning out the product as is. That's true of any product from any company, not just FFXIV from SE.

Nothing. But the answer to this question hardly tells us anything. We could ask:

"If a game is masking its flaws behind a fantastic story and universe, what happens to the playerbase when the story gets bad?"

Same thing that happens when the player base thinks the story is good.

Some quit playing. Others continue to play.

The player base is not a hive mind. There are different opinions about what is good and what is bad.

Don't worry about what others are thinking. If you think the game is good, keep playing. If you think the game is bad, quit playing. It could be you're not part of the demographic they want to please with current game design so continuing to stay subbed to complain about it is just throwing your money away.

[brinn12]

Some quit playing. Others continue to play.

The player base is not a hive mind. There are different opinions about what is good and what is bad.

Don't worry about what others are thinking. If you think the game is good, keep playing. If you think the game is bad, quit playing. It could be you're not part of the demographic they want to please with current game design so continuing to stay subbed to complain about it is just throwing your money away.

While other people's tastes, be they good or bad, should not change the way we enjoy a videogame, this does not mean we should ignore them.

If the majority of the playerbase dislikes a subscription based game to the point of quitting, that means your experiences will be affected. A company needs money to make a good product, which means they need people to pay for it.

The reality we have is, FFXIV was in an uptrend until Endwalker, and started a downtrend in Dawntrail, which coincides with the downfall of the MSQ. And whether a game is making more or less money than expected is not the same thing.

[User202503201232]

While other people's tastes, be they good or bad, should not change the way we enjoy a videogame, this does not mean we should ignore them.

If the majority of the playerbase dislikes a subscription based game to the point of quitting, that means your experiences will be affected. A company needs money to make a good product, which means they need people to pay for it.

The reality we have is, FFXIV was in an uptrend until Endwalker, and started a downtrend in Dawntrail, which coincides with the downfall of the MSQ. And whether a game is making more or less money than expected is not the same thing.

This your first time talking to Jojoya?

Don't bother lmao, they are the queen of concern trolling

They have 9060 posts on these forums and all of them are "actually some people like the game right now btw, so yeah it's actually not black and white!!"

They'll pull you into the orbit of this pointless discussion about how some people like X while others don't like X. The moment you get trapped in that orbit not even an escape velocity of c will allow you to go back to actual substantive critiques people were talking about earlier.

If that doesn't work, their next tactic is to laser focus on one single word or term you're using and get everyone to debate things like "what does it actually mean for there to be "content"".

[yesnt]

You're not going to get the player base to agree on what constitutes decent.

- Hats for all
- Krile needed more attention in DT
- give us job identity back
- no braindead dungeons
- idk what else, there is more than enough, for example, check the 200 pages of comments on the graphical update

I barely see people disagreeing on these topics. When I see them disagree, it's mostly because some people want to have fights with other players for the sake of having fights. The same topics being brought up over and over again is a pretty clear sign that a consistent level of disagreement exists. Of course there will always be one person who genuinely disagrees, but that's one person. Maybe two. Not enough to say that players disagree a lot.

[ViinaS]

What's wrong with visual novels?

A Visual Novel does not have a 40+ box price and a monthly sub attached to it.
And hilariously most Visual Novels that have anywhere near that box-price do have more interactive choices than DT MSQ.

[KillaKilala]

I would posit the return question..

Have you ever thought that the reason why so many comments are non-constructive yapping is because the developers never really actually deigned to listen to much of the feedback in the first place?

It's easy to come here and make the comments on non-constructive yapping, but many people have actually been providing feedback, consistently since as early as Stormblood, and the developers, if they have given recognition have demonstrated little thought to actually action it.. Or have only deigned to present a dismissive response such as "If you want engaging healing experience then go play Ultimates"

If you want more constructive threads then how about arguing about the severe lack of communication from developers?

Also, probably wouldn't go along and comparing playing Elden Ring or games of that nature to doing something like 30 minutes of custom deliveries.

I hope you never, ever have a complaint until you've done those 15,000 levequests.

Well I came around 5.5, and at that time everyone was saying how great the developers are and how they listened to the community and saved the game. So I can't say what was happening during Stormblood, except the thing I heard from Xeno, that the devs created 2 minute meta because players was complaining that aligning skills was too hard. As for the Elden Ring that's exactly what I meant. These games are too different, so they either shouldn't have delayed the expansion or should've made it harder.

That makes High-End content really, really good and lengthy content for most people. The problem is that a lot of people avoid anything that is "High-End", which leaves only the rest of the content you mentioned. And it's that other content that gets too repetitive or simple for many players.

It's their problem they're avoiding High-End content. Even the Utimates aren't that hard.

What kind of parties have you been in?

I've included the quests

Most of those asking for content want to be actively engaged. Pushing skill buttons. People are not asking for visual novels.

It's really not about the amount of content, but how engaging some of it is.

[Kaurhz]

Well I came around 5.5, and at that time everyone was saying how great the developers are and how they listened to the community and saved the game. So I can't say what was happening during Stormblood, except the thing I heard from Xeno, that the devs created 2 minute meta because players was complaining that aligning skills was too hard. As for the Elden Ring that's exactly what I meant. These games are too different, so they either shouldn't have delayed the expansion or should've made it harder.

So I hate to be this person, especially seeing as I know dismissiveness doesn't amount to much, but this is the problem that you don't really see or have a frame of reference for when people actually enjoyed the game itself. By 5.5, everything was already an established formula, so a lot of the intricate things that HW, and even to a degree what Stormblood offered just aren't understood or appreciated by a lot of modern players. Things like, how, even if you weren't a raider, the game had plenty other avenues of content which wanted your attention like crafting, unsync raids for Neo-Aetherstones as an entry-point for making Gil, or things like FC-based content (even if it was a flop), these were things that gave people a sense of wanderlust, something that has been absolutely lost to rote formula.

It's easy for anyone to say "Well you all asked for this", but can almost guarantee if you polled them on whether they liked how excessive they took it (from those that actually played and complained back then), can almost guarantee many would respond with "Too much."

They saved the game in the sense that it didn't go to the complete brink of death, and it's absolutely something that is commendable, but things like this shouldn't really preclude all other issues that people have with the game.. Like we aren't in 2013 anymore, and the reality is, is that these hand-picked examples of where the devs actually deigned to listen just aren't that great, since the list of things they do not listen to is far more monumental. and from my experience, people took as much issue with the 2-minute meta, than what took issue with overall design back in HW and SB (With the exception of maybe things like Cross-class abilities), so realistically if they did actually listen then this issue will not have persisted for over 8 years with only recently being a topic of discussion with vague remarks like "Maybe we overdid it".. This tells me personally that their concern was not exclusively with actually listening to the feedback, but more so the fact of trying to remove as many fail states from the game as humanly possible. Things like BLM changes are an utter testament to this fact, as is the complete and utter obliteration of the crafting system, they've reduced this to such a state where, whether you're a scrip go-er, someone who did average melds or someone who invested millions and millions of Gil into melding, then the result discrepancy is barely noticeable beyond maybe an additional HW mat, they've reduced it to such a state where even macro differences barely exist. If they were concerned expressly with the feedback then the thing is, things like "we overdid it" shouldn't actually be a thing, especially when you've overdone it to such an excessive degree that even the casual players, such as myself (who are generally least affected by such changes, just between goals, reasons for playing the game, and general overall knowledge), are absolutely up in arms about everything.

I disagree on the comment of Elden Ring... The games are starkly different, but the overlap in audiences is very clearly there to where there is an advantage in delaying it. The point is that the amount of engagement you get out of doing, say, a custom delivery and exploring Elden Ring is just so, so starkly different. Like sure, you can equivocate to say "You get 60 hours out of this", but you also "get 60 hours out of this", but the underlying quality is just leaps and bounds different.

Edit: Also, on the not of.. We have enough content, but the issue missing is replayability, this may be true to an extent, but the result is really the same, and there is still a fundamental issue in that long-term they are relying on the same 3-4 major content types each expansion to provide that replayability, since it's eventually going to get stale, if it hasn't already... With very little demonstration in willing to take some risk to try something new... This is just as big a problem as something like what we had in Endwalker where we had all these content types but no excuse to actually do them more than once.

[Basteala]

Even if it's 17.5 hours for 15 a month, considering a 4 month, 2 week period between 7.1 and 7.2, that's 67.50 USD, not 15--let alone *13*. 17.5 for almost 70 dollars vs 60 for around 60 dollars. Even if you include the dailies and frontlines--which is ludicrous, considering that this isn't new content by any means, the difference in time per dollar is staggering. And that's ignoring the actual quality of the content!

[KillaKilala]

Even if it's 17.5 hours for 15 a month, considering a 4 month, 2 week period between 7.1 and 7.2, that's 67.50 USD, not 15--let alone *13*. 17.5 for almost 70 dollars vs 60 for around 60 dollars. Even if you include the dailies and frontlines--which is ludicrous, considering that this isn't new content by any means, the difference in time per dollar is staggering. And that's ignoring the actual quality of the content!

Yeah but why do you stay subbed if you don't play the game? Just unsub lol
And I've included dailies because I personally do them even after all these years, and everyone I know do them too. If you wanna include a small percentage of people who doesn't do dailies, then we're including the ultimate and reclears to the calculation, which adds hundreds of hours.

[Larirawiel]

Yeah but why do you stay subbed if you don't play the game? Just unsub lol

Now imagine what happens if the players will follow this advice.


Cheers