changes to the game that would go hard

[Collin_Sky]

Nah, it isn't what happens now. What happens now is that an expansion releases, you buy the uncapped tome gear to do extreme, then you get extreme gear (which serves no purpose other than parsing). Then you buy a set of crafted gear to do savage. Most people stop here and don't do ultimate on content. They might do it later but we'll have access to higher ilvl gear and you won't need savage gear by then. For the people who do prog savage on content, you do actually get some mileage out of your tome/savage gear but the 4 month delay between savage and ultimate completely removes any feeling of progression.

The tomes for that uncapped gear come from dungeons, which also drop the accessories you need before you can even get the uncapped tome gear. It’s essentially the same process.

I'm fine with crafted gear allowing people to catch up but it shouldn't be mandatory and should not replace your previous BiS. It should be the same ilvl as previous BiS.1

Even if it were the same ilvl, it would still be stronger because 5 materia slots > 2. Granted, some pieces have less desirable substats like SKS or TEN, but in general, more slots still provides a clear advantage.

Yes, I'm looking at gearing from the perspective of it being functionally beneficial in-game, rather than tangentially beneficial in the FFLogs metagame.
Because, as garbage as it is, the illusion of progression is the only progression that the game affords them. There's nothing else to do. Reclearing for gear so you can play content without grey parsing is better than clearing once and coming back in 8 months.

But wanting to improve my performance isn’t only about parsing. I’d still strive for better gear even if logs didn’t exist. Saying the only reason to gear up is for FFLogs is incredibly reductive.

I’ve offered plenty of reasons why gearing multiple jobs at a decent pace is reasonable, yet the only response you've provided is "lol it doesn't matter you don't really need the gear just stop caring about your parse". I actually enjoy the content we have, I’d just like to play it on other jobs without feeling like I’m griefing the party because I want to play something that isn't my main.

[BigCheez]

The tomes for that uncapped gear come from dungeons, which also drop the accessories you need before you can even get the uncapped tome gear. It’s essentially the same process.



Even if it were the same ilvl, it would still be stronger because 5 materia slots > 2. Granted, some pieces have less desirable substats like SKS or TEN, but in general, more slots still provides a clear advantage.



But wanting to improve my performance isn’t only about parsing. I’d still strive for better gear even if logs didn’t exist. Saying the only reason to gear up is for FFLogs is incredibly reductive.

I’ve offered plenty of reasons why gearing multiple jobs at a decent pace is reasonable, yet the only response you've provided is "lol it doesn't matter you don't really need the gear just stop caring about your parse". I actually enjoy the content we have, I’d just like to play it on other jobs without feeling like I’m griefing the party because I want to play something that isn't my main.

Most people just run a couple of hunt trains for enough tomes for a full set of gear + clusters for the materia to meld it. Pretending that we're doing anything other than a very short mindless zerg for that gear is a little disingenuous.

Get rid of the overmeld slots or make crafted gear a few ilvl lower than previous BiS then. This feels like a very easily solved problem.

I completely agree that improving at a game is one of the most fulfilling parts of playing them but equipping a new stat stick doesn't really factor in to that. Optimising strats and ability usages are the interesting parts of an MMO. Gear should be a means to an end but FFXIV has no end.

The fact that you consider running savage without savage gear to be griefing demonstrates the problem with gearing in FFXIV better than anything that I could say. In the nicest possible way, I think you've been playing FFXIV exclusively for too long, have become XIVbrained and can't see past the status quo. I'd recommend trying another MMO, like XI or WoW, if only for a short time to remind yourself what meaningful player power progression in an MMO actually looks like. Getting new gear is infinitely more rewarding when it will allow you to do something that you weren't able to do before. Getting new gear to make the content that you're already able to do easier, and then throwing it in the trash and replacing it with a new freebie for the next piece of content, is just pointless busywork.

Working your way through ambu to omen to dyna and beyond in FFXI is fun. Pushing through heroic/mythic or pushing M+ keys in WoW is fun. Doing savage to get savage gear so the same boss you were already able to kill dies 6 minutes into the 10 minute fight is not particularly interesting or fun. The fulfilling part is supposed to be the progression that comes as a result of that upgrade but it's absent in FFXIV.

[Collin_Sky]

The fact that you consider running savage without savage gear to be griefing demonstrates the problem with gearing in FFXIV better than anything that I could say. In the nicest possible way, I think you've been playing FFXIV exclusively for too long, have become XIVbrained and can't see past the status quo. I'd recommend trying another MMO, like XI or WoW, if only for a short time to remind yourself what meaningful player power progression in an MMO actually looks like. Getting new gear is infinitely more rewarding when it will allow you to do something that you weren't able to do before. Getting new gear to make the content that you're already able to do easier, and then throwing it in the trash and replacing it with a new freebie for the next piece of content, is just pointless busywork.

Working your way through ambu to omen to dyna and beyond in FFXI is fun. Pushing through heroic/mythic or pushing M+ keys in WoW is fun. Doing savage to get savage gear so the same boss you were already able to kill dies 6 minutes into the 10 minute fight is not particularly interesting or fun. The fulfilling part is supposed to be the progression that comes as a result of that upgrade but it's absent in FFXIV.

For what it’s worth, I still play FFXI regularly. I 6box and can fully clear Ody C/Sortie on 3 of them (working on the other 3 now). I’ve more or less completed the game, which is why I'm doing 3 more chars. I love FFXI's endgame gearing progression. Furthermore, I also agree that FFXIV offers very little content by comparison, which is why I keep returning to FFXI. Unlike FFXIV, FFXI doesn’t heavily restrict how you gear up, and it offers far more than just two pieces of content for progression.

In FFXIV, I’m left with no real choice but to run the same content repeatedly, either to help friends or just for fun and to push for self improvement. But at minimum ilvl, neither of those is really possible. I love FFXIV's combat, but I can't enjoy it when I don't have any goals.